[Korea-chapter] [h-anim] composable behaviors, animations, sequencers

Joe D Williams joedwil at earthlink.net
Sun Jul 14 20:45:22 PDT 2013 

Thank You, I will study 1Jin.
Best Regards,
Joe


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Myeong Won Lee" <myeongwonlee at gmail.com>
To: "Joe D Williams" <joedwil at earthlink.net>
Cc: "Don Brutzman" <brutzman at nps.edu>; "Myeong Won Lee" 
<mwlee at suwon.ac.kr>; "Human Animation working group" 
<h-anim at web3d.org>; <korea-chapter at web3d.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2013 8:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Korea-chapter] [h-anim] composable behaviors, 
animations, sequencers


> Dear Joe,
>
> I have attached our first H-Anim character named "1Jin".
> An image file for its texture is also included.
> Its resolution looks not good in the BS Contact viewer, but very 
> good in
> other tools.
> We must figure out the difference of the resolution.
> We used IndexedFaceSet for the geomery of each segment per joint.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Myeong
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 1:05 AM, Joe D Williams 
> <joedwil at earthlink.net>wrote:
>
>> However, it is not easy and very complex to apply those 
>> interpolators to
>>> other character models, including ours.
>>>
>>
>> If the HAnimJoint DEF names are the same, it should be simple to 
>> use the
>> current example animations to control your characters.
>>
>>
>>  We are testing if the 10 characters can be animated using the same
>>> interpolators as used for Allen and Nancy.
>>>
>>
>> Using the animations in the latest Spec 'motion' version would be 
>> best.
>>
>>
>>  > However, X3D-Edit does not display the characters correctly (it 
>>  >
>>> displays
>>> just a black scene).
>>>
>>
>> If Don can't see the file and troubleshoot, he can't fix X3D Edit.
>>
>> I suggest sending me a file for one of the characters so I can take 
>> a look
>> and perhaps help identify details needed to reuse the example 
>> animations
>> with your characters. Please send me .x3d file to read.  I will 
>> report back
>> as soon as I can.
>>
>> Thanks Again for your important work.
>> Best Regards,
>> Joe
>>
>>
>>
>> .
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Myeong Won Lee" <
>> myeongwonlee at gmail.com>
>> To: "Joe D Williams" <joedwil at earthlink.net>
>> Cc: "Don Brutzman" <brutzman at nps.edu>; "Myeong Won Lee" 
>> <mwlee at suwon.ac.kr>;
>> "Human Animation working group" <h-anim at web3d.org>; <
>> korea-chapter at web3d.org>
>> Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2013 6:27 AM
>>
>> Subject: Re: [Korea-chapter] [h-anim] composable behaviors, 
>> animations,
>> sequencers
>>
>>
>>  Dear Joe,
>>>
>>> Thank you for your comments.
>>>
>>> Our 10 example X3D H-Anim characters were first designed with 3ds 
>>> MAX then
>>> converted from WRL files to X3D files. Our method for their design 
>>> can be
>>> applied using many other tools in the same manner, as long as 
>>> those tools
>>> support WRL files. Our viewer includes the conversion function, 
>>> wrl-to-x3d
>>> (hanim).
>>>
>>> The X3D files are readable text files.
>>> X3D validation for all the X3D files was completed a while ago, as 
>>> I
>>> presented them at previous Korea chapter meetings, as well as at 
>>> SC24
>>> meetings.
>>>
>>> The 10 characters can also be displayed in the BS Contact viewer.
>>> However, X3D-Edit does not display the characters correctly (it 
>>> displays
>>> just a black scene).
>>> We are testing if the 10 characters can be animated using the same
>>> interpolators as used for Allen and Nancy.
>>> However, it is not easy and very complex to apply those 
>>> interpolators to
>>> other character models, including ours.
>>> This is our dilemma, but we must  figure out how to apply the
>>> interpolators
>>> of one character to other characters.
>>>
>>> I am looking over the work that you and Don have done recently by 
>>> going
>>> through the emails.
>>> Thank you for sending all the information.
>>> I will ask questions later if there are problems to discuss.
>>>
>>> Sincerely,
>>>
>>> Myeong
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 3:35 AM, Joe D Williams 
>>> <joedwil at earthlink.net
>>> >wrote:
>>>
>>>  Hi Myeong,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  I will bring our 10 example H-Anim characters designed by 3ds 
>>>> Max to the
>>>>
>>>>> Siggraph H-Anim meeting.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Thank you for this. I think it does not matter which tool the 
>>>> author uses
>>>> in design and animation, it is the actual human readable X3D 
>>>> HAnim user
>>>> code that represents each character that is of primary 
>>>> importance.
>>>>
>>>> At any point in the process, I think it should be possible to 
>>>> produce a
>>>> text file showing what is happening inside, in the actual user 
>>>> code that
>>>> defines and animates the character.
>>>> I haven't discussed this detail specifically in the working group 
>>>> but,
>>>> for
>>>> example, that is why we are not moving forward now with the 
>>>> existing
>>>> 'diverse models' HAnim change.
>>>> We only had one X3D player that demonstrated the very important 
>>>> concept
>>>> and no running prototypes. Some interest, but perhaps more 
>>>> interest in
>>>> just
>>>> sticking to the simplist way of just drawing everything directly 
>>>> in
>>>> skeleton space instead of providing a systematic way to adjust 
>>>> things
>>>> into
>>>> skeleton space.
>>>>
>>>> Historically, this is similar to the step between hanim level1 
>>>> where
>>>> geometry is part of a segment and the level2 deformable skin 
>>>> where the
>>>> 'skin' is part of the humanoid with movement controlled by joint
>>>> bindings.
>>>> This step was practically impossible to prototype (see boxman 
>>>> script and
>>>> bsC protos). It took an interval to get this best practice, along 
>>>> with
>>>> the
>>>> best practice displacer methods, of skin animation running in 
>>>> more than
>>>> one
>>>> browser. Yet today deformable skin is supported widely.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  because we realized some problems in wrl files.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Maybe we can help. I can't think of a better forum to deal with 
>>>> wrl, x3d
>>>> or general humanoid animation probems than our consortuium so 
>>>> please
>>>> bring
>>>> these problems forward.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  All the characters can be animated using BVH motion capture 
>>>> files in our
>>>>
>>>>> motion viewer.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Of course the goal is that we can define a system that can be 
>>>> used in
>>>> every X3D tool. I think understanding of bvh format and best 
>>>> practice
>>>> conversion to native X3D data types is important because it 
>>>> provides an
>>>> interface with consumer devices that are being widely used. We 
>>>> recieved
>>>> this link from an early contributor to h-anim
>>>> http://cg.cis.upenn.edu/hms/****research/ADAPT/<http://cg.cis.upenn.edu/hms/**research/ADAPT/>
>>>> <http://cg.cis.**upenn.edu/hms/research/ADAPT/<http://cg.cis.upenn.edu/hms/research/ADAPT/>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> as another example. I hope you can meet with Norm at the show.
>>>>
>>>> To me it is most important that there is not a rush to define a 
>>>> standard
>>>> but we search for the true best practices by testing several 
>>>> working
>>>> solutions.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  All the animaiton sequences can be stored as an animation file
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> That goes right along with existing X3D HAnim practice. Either 
>>>> generate
>>>> the data using scripts or interpolators and/or import data as a 
>>>> string
>>>> or a
>>>> file.
>>>>
>>>> I think another very important part of the motion proposal is the 
>>>> detail
>>>> that the proposal introduces a change from 'realtime' to a fixed 
>>>> or
>>>> variable author specified frames per second mode (fps).
>>>> I think this is a way to synchronize the X3D player to some sort 
>>>> of
>>>> capture or rendering device that works at fixed or known frame 
>>>> intervals,
>>>> such as 'video' capture/playback.
>>>> As usual, with X3D there are several ways to get this done and 
>>>> please
>>>> keep
>>>> in mind that we must search for a general solution to this method 
>>>> of
>>>> animation capture/playback in X3D.
>>>>
>>>> I am also hoping you can briefly overview some of the current 
>>>> work of
>>>> evaluation and validation of the existing HAnim model by showing 
>>>> the
>>>> three
>>>> specification examples we have been working on.
>>>>
>>>> Have fun in California.
>>>> Thank You and Best Regards,
>>>> Joe
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Myeong Won Lee" <
>>>> myeongwonlee at gmail.com>
>>>> To: "Don Brutzman" <brutzman at nps.edu>
>>>> Cc: "Joe D Williams" <joedwil at earthlink.net>; "Myeong Won Lee" <
>>>> mwlee at suwon.ac.kr>; "Human Animation working group" 
>>>> <h-anim at web3d.org>;
>>>> <
>>>> korea-chapter at web3d.org>
>>>> Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2013 6:40 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Korea-chapter] [h-anim] composable behaviors, 
>>>> animations,
>>>> sequencers
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  Dear Don,
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I will bring our 10 example H-Anim characters designed by 3ds 
>>>>> Max to the
>>>>> Siggraph H-Anim meeting.
>>>>> We are testing them again if their formats are valid although 
>>>>> they
>>>>> are similar as I presented several times, because we realized 
>>>>> some
>>>>> problems
>>>>> in wrl files.
>>>>> All the characters can be animated using BVH motion capture 
>>>>> files in our
>>>>> motion viewer.
>>>>> All the animaiton sequences can be stored as an animation file
>>>>> (temporarily, "hanim" file extension is used).
>>>>>
>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>>
>>>>> Myeong
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 11:45 PM, Don Brutzman <brutzman at nps.edu> 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>  Joe, thanks for your note, makes sense.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Based on last night's work, am also thinking that there are a 
>>>>>> few broad
>>>>>> categories of animation:
>>>>>> - composable behaviors that animate the body itself (Walk,
>>>>>> WaveLeftHand,
>>>>>> etc.) i.e. your demonstrated set of blendable behaviors
>>>>>> - animations that move the body from place to place
>>>>>> (WalkDownTwelfthStreet, WalkInCircle, TangoMotionCapture)
>>>>>> - sequencers (WalkDownTwelfthStreet, TurnAround, Wait 10s, 
>>>>>> SitDown at
>>>>>> bus
>>>>>> stop, Wait for bus, StandUp)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Any other categories or use cases?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Myeong Won Lee, the most helpful things we might get from you 
>>>>>> (and
>>>>>> others)
>>>>>> would be example X3D scenes from your work that we might test 
>>>>>> and try
>>>>>> out.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> all the best, Don
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Don Brutzman  Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br
>>>>>> brutzman at nps.edu
>>>>>> Watkins 270,  MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA
>>>>>> +1.831.656.2149
>>>>>> X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics 
>>>>>> http://faculty.nps.edu/**
>>>>>> brutzman 
>>>>>> <http://faculty.nps.edu/****brutzman<http://faculty.nps.edu/**brutzman>
>>>>>> <http://faculty.nps.**edu/brutzman 
>>>>>> <http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman>>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ______________________________******_________________
>>>>>> Korea-chapter mailing list
>>>>>> Korea-chapter at web3d.org
>>>>>> http://web3d.org/mailman/******listinfo/korea-chapter_web3d.******org<http://web3d.org/mailman/****listinfo/korea-chapter_web3d.****org>
>>>>>> <http://web3d.org/**mailman/**listinfo/korea-**chapter_web3d.**org<http://web3d.org/mailman/**listinfo/korea-chapter_web3d.**org>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> <http://web3d.org/mailman/****listinfo/korea-chapter_web3d.****org<http://web3d.org/mailman/**listinfo/korea-chapter_web3d.**org>
>>>>>> <http://web3d.org/mailman/**listinfo/korea-chapter_web3d.**org<http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/korea-chapter_web3d.org>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Myeong Won Lee
>>>>> College of IT, U. of Suwon
>>>>> Hwasung-si, Gyeonggi-do, 445-743 Korea
>>>>> Tel) +82-31-220-2313, +82-10-8904-4634
>>>>> E-mail) mwlee at suwon.ac.kr
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Myeong Won Lee
>>> College of IT, U. of Suwon
>>> Hwasung-si, Gyeonggi-do, 445-743 Korea
>>> Tel) +82-31-220-2313, +82-10-8904-4634
>>> E-mail) mwlee at suwon.ac.kr
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
> -- 
> Myeong Won Lee
> College of IT, U. of Suwon
> Hwasung-si, Gyeonggi-do, 445-743 Korea
> Tel) +82-31-220-2313, +82-10-8904-4634
> E-mail) mwlee at suwon.ac.kr
>

More information about the Korea-chapter mailing list