[x3d-public] Minutes for X3D working group Wednesday 13 MAR 2018

Don Brutzman brutzman at nps.edu
Wed Mar 14 09:55:15 PDT 2018 

Attendees: Havele, Marchetti, Polys, Puk and Brutzman

Background: Web3D Consortium Working Groups
===========================================
	Web3D Consortium Working Groups are technical committees that consider and develop solutions for specific technical challenges and opportunities.
	Working group charters are reviewed by the Board of Directors to meet the needs of the Consortium and the community.

	The Extensible 3D (X3D) Working Group coordinates all technical development efforts.
	Working groups are essentially driven by the efforts of participants.
	They focus on issues and technologies that produce improvements to our open standards, always achieving results that are royalty free for any purpose.
	All efforts are geared towards improving a coordinated set of steadily evolving ISO standards including X3D Version 4.

	http://www.web3d.org/working-groups
===========================================

We reviewed these words and thought they still looked OK!   8)

A. X3D Working Group schedule planning as reviewed for this week and next week.

Additional items on upcoming schedule:

- *Design Printing and Scanning working group* Thursday 08-0900 pacific, agenda posted to cad at web3d.org list
   We plan to develop Ideas for resources and project ideas to be made available to participants in VRHackathon in June 2018, likely just prior to Web3D Conference in Poznan Poland.
   For example, scans and other assets that can be modified and printed.  VR Hackathon prospectus expected soon.  Thinking about Building Information Management (BIM) as well.

- *Communications team* weekly teleconference is Friday morning 08-0900 pacific.  Inputs always welcome.

- *SIGGRAPH planning* there will be no Web3D booth in Vancouver this summer, CARTO BOF is being planned..  Anita sent a request for BOFs to working group chairs - can they all be on a single day - likely Wednesday?  Essentially needs to know what groups want a BOF: medical, VR/AR, design/printing/scanning, X3Dv4, Korea Chapter.  Need BOF summary and title please.

	https://s2018.siggraph.org

1. Our agenda for this Wednesday 13 MAR 2018 is triage of new (unhandled) Mantis issues which appear below.  We will start by integrating recent issue feedback from mailing list.

2. Recent HAnim issues identified during ISO specification review will be evaluated during the next HAnim Working Group call, tentatively scheduled Wednesday 21 March 1700 pacific (Thursday 22 March morning Korea time).

3. Next week Wednesday 20 MAR 2018 we will focus on X3D JSON issues.  Background:

	X3D JSON Encoding
	http://www.web3d.org/wiki/index.php/X3D_JSON_Encoding

	X3D to JSON Stylesheet Converter
	http://www.web3d.org/x3d/stylesheets/X3dToJson.html

	X3D Resources: Example Scene Archives for X3D
	http://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dResources.html#Examples
	includes 3900 example X3D .json scenes, for example
	http://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/HelloWorld.json

a. John Carlson will review progress with X3DJSONLD implementation, and we will both discuss alignment with X3DJSAIL.
	https://github.com/coderextreme/X3DJSONLD
	http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dJsonSchemaDocumentation3.3/x3d-3.3-JSONSchema.html

b. What steps are necessary to updating our X3D JSON Schema to handle bugs discovered in unit testing of example archives.
	http://www.web3d.org/specifications/x3d-3.3-JSONSchema.json

c. Consider potential upgrades of X3D JSON Schema to latest IETF working draft.
	https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JSON#JSON_Schema
	http://json-schema.org	

d. Consider potential autogeneration of X3D JSON Schema using X3D Unified Object Model.
	X3D Unified Object Model (X3DUOM)
	http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3DUOM.html
	http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3DObjectModel-3.3.xml

e. Specification drafting plans (Web3D member access, on request)
	GitHub Web3D Consortium Specifications: X3D
	https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D

specifically under the Encodings section at
https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D/tree/master/ISO-IEC%2019776/ISO-IEC%2019776-5/ISO-IEC%2019776-5%20V3.3/ISO-IEC%2019776-5%20V3.3%20WD1

Our road map is at

	Web3D Recommended Standards
	http://www.web3d.org/standards

	Web3D Specification Relationships
	http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dSpecificationRelationships.png

4. Participation.  All X3D Working Group members are welcome to attend.  Connection details at

	Web3D Teleconference Information
	http://www.web3d.org/member/teleconference-information

X3D community members who have specific feedback on given Mantis issues or X3D JSON Encoding are also welcome to participate for these two meetings.  Please send email feedback to the archived mailing list, otherwise contact me for specific meeting connection information.

Community inputs are essential for improving the X3D/HAnim specifications.  So is Web3D Consortium membership - we also hope that you will join.  Membership has value... to you, and to everyone.
	http://www.web3d.org/join

Thanks for considering the possibilities and all feedback.  Have fun with X3D!  8)

=======================================================================================================
Question regarding "containerField" in X3D encoding: is this construct unique to XML encoding?

Answer: the information describing field relationship between every parent-child node is listed in all encodings.  Thus you can find the same information in VRML/ClassicVRML/JSON encodings.

In most encodings, this field-name relationship is always explicit.

In XML encoding, the scene graph is terser because defaults are implicit and can usually be omitted in a file.  (If you read it into an HTML graph, and the X3D player supports Schema/DTD defaults, then default containerField values are also readable in the DOM.)  The explicit containerField exceptions are listed - there are only 8 such ambiguities that need containerField.  Please see

	X3D Scene Authoring Hints: containerField
	http://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dSceneAuthoringHints.html#containerField

=======================================================================================================

On 2/15/2018 5:32 AM, Roy Walmsley wrote:
> [...]
> =======================================================================================================
> 
> *_B. Discussion Topics_*
> 
>  1. _Triage of new Mantis issues_

Warmup exercise: Andreas Plesch suggested renaming of component file group.html to grouping.html

http://web3d.org/mailman/private/x3d_web3d.org/2018-March/006896.html

Added as Mantis issue 1224
http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=1224

Agreed to resolve as posted.  This is a "simple" comment, but perhaps-surprisingly involved to resolve.

Elapsed times:
- 10 minutes reviewing on mailing lists (many people)
- 20 minutes discussing this and other procedures (handful of people)
- 10 minutes entering into Mantis

We then pressed on to actually execute the changes:

- Search "group.html" found 81 occurrences in 34 files
- Similarly interp.html (34 changes) and geodata.html (31 changes) were found and fixed.
- 10 minutes to make global-search-replace changes, commit and push

Thus ~40 minutes for "simple" change.

Additional changes deferred, those noted so far are in Nicholas comment
http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=1224#c2292

So... it all takes time.  People should join and contribute to Web3D Consortium if they want an X3D v4 specification to ship.

Thanks Andreas and everyone participating in this particular issue.

We next discussed HAnim specifications and ISO-Web3D procedures.

Next issues deferred to next meeting: specification editors will continue Thursday 9-10 pacific.
==========================================================================
==========================================================================

[from previous meeting]
On 3/5/2018 10:58 AM, Don Brutzman wrote:
>>>>
>>>>  1. _Triage of new Mantis issues_
>>>>
>>>> Mantis 1209 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=1209 – 19775-1, 13.3.5 Extrusion - Tesselation of quadrilaterals missing for various nodes
>>
>> Updated issue, sent inquiry to public list.
> 
> Multiple responses, thanks everyone.  We will review and integrate key points (plus links and credit) into Mantis.

Michalis Kamburelis,
	http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2018-March/008299.html

Andreas Plesch,
	http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2018-March/008300.html

> [...]
>>>> Mantis 1214 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=1214 – 19775-1, 21.4.2 StringSensor - OS clipboard copying to/from StringSensor
>>
>> Added notes.  Separately posted to x3d-public list.
>> http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=1214
> 
> Multiple responses, thanks everyone.  We will review and integrate key points (plus links and credit) into Mantis.

Doug Sanden and follow-on thread,
	http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2018-March/008296.html

> [...]
> Mantis 1218 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=1218 – 19775-1, 7.2.4 MetadataDate - New node type, or new data type
> 
>  2. _Triage of older Mantis issues still at status New_
> 
> Mantis 787 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=787 – 19776-1, 5.6 SFFloat and MFFloat - Encoding of real numbers
> 
> Mantis 786 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=786 – 19775-1, 34.3.1 X3DEnvironmentTextureNode - Inconsistent hierarchy
> 
> Mantis 785 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=785 – 19775-1, 28.3.6 TransmitterPdu - Inconsistent hierarchy
> 
> Mantis 784 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=784 – 19775-1, 28.3.5 SignalPdu - Inconsistent hierarchy
> 
> Mantis 783 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=783 – 19775-1, 28.3.4 ReceiverPdu - Inconsistent hierarchy
> 
> Mantis 782 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=782 – 19775-1, 28.3.3 EspduTransform - Inconsistent hierarchy
> 
> Mantis 781 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=781 – 19775-1, 28.3.2 DISEntityTypeMapping - Inconsistent hierarchy
> 
> Mantis 780 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=780 – 19775-1, 25.3.11 GeoViewpoint - Inconsistent hierarchy
> 
> Mantis 778 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=778 – 19775-1, Clause 38 - Inconsistent name and title
> 
> Mantis 777 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=777 – 19775-1, 13.3.3.5.3 Algorithmic description - Algorithm not precision dependent
> 
> Mantis 776 - http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=776  - 19775-1, 26 Humanoid animation (H-Anim) component - Component levels
> 
> =======================================================================================================

all the best, Don
-- 
Don Brutzman  Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br       brutzman at nps.edu
Watkins 270,  MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA   +1.831.656.2149
X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman

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