[x3d-public] jupyter notebook; X3DOM syntax forincludingX3DwithinHTML

John Carlson yottzumm at gmail.com
Sun Jun 2 06:02:45 PDT 2019

Yes, they do now!


Now I have to fix my X3DOM examples to use MFStrings.


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From: Holger Seelig
Sent: Sunday, June 2, 2019 2:49 AM
To: x3d-public at web3d.org
Subject: Re: [x3d-public] jupyter notebook; X3DOM syntax forincludingX3DwithinHTML

The are some issues with the example. To get it work first include the latest version of X_ITE AND x_ite_dom!
<link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="https://code.create3000.de/x_ite/4.5.3/dist/x_ite.css"/>
<script type="text/javascript" src="https://code.create3000.de/x_ite/4.5.3/dist/x_ite.min.js"></script>
<script type="text/javascript" src="https://raw.githack.com/andreasplesch/x_ite_dom/master/release/x_ite_dom.1.1.js"></script>
The second issue is, that the url of the Inline node must be wrapped in double quotes AND single quotes because it is an MFString field:
<Inline url='"ArchHalf.x3d"'></Inline>
Then the example should work.
Best regards,

On 02.06.19 07:42, John Carlson wrote:
Someone can try modifying this example:
It appears that Inlines don’t work with JSON or XML in  X_ITE?  I’m missing the main scene or something?
I can make it work with src on the X3DCanvas tag.  What matters now is can we make it work like we want.
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From: John Carlson
Sent: Sunday, June 2, 2019 12:00 AM
To: Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV); Andreas Plesch
Cc: X3D Graphics public mailing list
Subject: RE: [x3d-public] jupyter notebook; X3DOM syntax for includingX3Dwithin HTML
See variety of inputs into web page (X_ITE and X3DOM) here:
I believe I either use XML or DOM to get the JSON or XML scene into the page, even though on the surface, I may be working with JSON.
Excerpt for XML:
    <X3D xmlns:xsd="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance" profile="Immersive" version="3.3" xsd:noNamespaceSchemaLocation="http://www.web3d.org/specifications/x3d-3.3.xsd" showProgress="false" showStat='false' showLog='false' width='150px' height='75px' backend='webgl'>
                <Scene id="x3domxml">
    <X3DCanvas id='x_itexml' cache='false'>
           <p>Your browser may not support all features required by X_ITE!</p>
function load_X_ITE_XML(content, selector) {
        X3D(function() {
                var browser = X3D.getBrowser(selector);
        }, function() {
                alert("Failed to render XML to X_ITE");
/** for X3DOM **/
                     var doc = document.querySelector(selector);
                        if (doc.hasRuntime && doc.runtime.ready) {
                                try {
                                } catch (e) {
So it appears possible to load X3D via JavaScript (not an Inline, but follow me).
It would be instructive to create an equivalent mechanism via inlines.  I believe this has been shown:
https://coderextreme.net/X3DJSONLD/src/main/html/x_iteexamples.html (note missing X3D element, hmm)

If you like, you may show the equivalent for XML (It would be best to try with VRML as well, I haven’t done that).
Enjoy!  Wow, feels good working together folks!
It would be problematic to use both X_ITE and X3DOM if X_ITE on the same page if you relied only on X3D nodes like X3DOM does.   It would be hard to distinguish which browser to use if only X3D tags are used.
Perhaps we need an official X3D tag implementation that can forward to either X3DOM or X_ITE based on an attribute?
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
From: Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV)
Sent: Saturday, June 1, 2019 11:23 PM
To: Andreas Plesch; John Carlson
Cc: X3D Graphics public mailing list
Subject: Re: [x3d-public] jupyter notebook; X3DOM syntax for including X3Dwithin HTML
Thanks for continuing scrutiny, this issue is quite important for X3Dv4 specification efforts.
I think an earlier version of X_ITE used regular X3D elements without problem - not sure, that was some time ago.  Hard to tell now since the online .html examples all seem to use <X3DCanvas src="somesuch"><!-- fallback --></X3DCanvas>
I spot-checked a few of the examples, am seeing same X3DCanvas pattern at
Perhaps X3DOM is avoiding direct inclusion and parsing of .x3d source for same reason?
Looks like you've worked on this in X_ITE already Andreas
* http://create3000.de/x_ite/getting-started/#xhtml-dom-integration
* http://create3000.de/x_ite/xhtml-dom-integration/
* http://create3000.de/x_ite/xhtml-dom-integration/#example
* http://media.create3000.de/create3000/dom-integration/dom.integration.xhtml
                                <X3DCanvas class="browser" timings="false">
                                                <img class="fallback" src="XHTML.png"/>
                                                <X3D xmlns="http://www.web3d.org/specifications/x3d-namespace" id="spheres">
                                                                <Scene DEF='scene'>
Wondering if you had tried a .html version of that preceding file, and what any difficulties might have been?
Wondering why you have a DEF on the <Scene> ?  If applying HTML events, presumably it could be an id="scene" reference instead.
SVG recommendation allows singleton elements in fragments within HTML, also seems to sometimes use namespaces and sometimes not.  Also SVG appears to have at least 2 lowerCamelCase elements, clipPath and foreignObject, plus a large number of lowerCamelCase attributes - so not every element/attribute has to be all lower case.
                Scalable Vector Graphics (SVG) 2
                W3C Candidate Recommendation 04 October 2018
                Chapter 5: Document Structure
Also wondering if you folks think that the <X3DCanvas src=""/> pattern from X_ITE is something we should repeat for X3DOM.  Seems like a good fallback that supports multiple X3D encodings.
I recommend that we try to pursue every possibility that might allow inclusion of .x3d (XML valid) models "as is" within the HTML page.  Certainly the fact that they work when relabeled as an XHTML page shows that it is possible.  SVG also provides corrolary evidence that it is possible.  If we force a special conversion of all X3D models used in HTML, then
- that has a huge impact on the number of just-slightly-different scenes that get created,
- it greatly complicates validation, and
- it also is a huge negative when trying to edit/test/apply improvements to a model when the deployed version has unnecessarily different syntax from the original version.
As far as jupyter goes, since that notebook supports python and a wide variety of embedded languages I expect that we will be able to align satisfactorily as this work proceeds - you've made great progress already.
On 5/31/2019 5:56 PM, Andreas Plesch wrote:
> Well, if it was xhtml we were talking about you would be correct.
> But, it is html without the x which is expected by the HTML renderer
> in Jupyter. There is no XHTML renderer since the Jupyter notebook
> itself is a HTML document.
> And html allows singleton tags only for certain tags, at least in how
> all browser parse the markup, and probably also as defined in the
> HTML5 spec. These certain tags may include all known HTML elements
> which do not use their text content. Unfortunately, the X3D tags are
> considered Unknown Elements by html and they seem to require the
> explicit end tag.
> x3dom does not use any HTML parsing libraries but completely relies on
> the web browser to do the parsing. And the browsers get confused,
> because they do not understand the singleton x3d tags in a html
> document.
> Alas, if the xml serializing library in X3DJSAIL does not have an
> option to generate full tags (they would be still legal XML, no?), we
> would need to settle for xhtml IFrames which can also be included in a
> Jupyter notebook (but not tested yet), or, as another option, wrap the
> xml X3D into an Inline since x3dom always uses the browser XML parser
> for Inlines. Would x3d.toStringX3DInline(filename) be considered too
> extravagant ? It would generate an xml X3D document string with a
> single Inline node, and also the content X3D in the file filename.
> x3d.toFileX3DInline(x3dFileName, inlineFileName) would generate two
> files.
> Perhaps Python has an option to serialize out the full tags, perhaps
> as HTMLFragments. Then a x3d.toStringFullTags() could be included
> outside of X3DJSAIL, and with X3DPSAIL.
> To consider X_ITE and x3dom together it would be first necessary get
> X_ITE to work at all with Jupyter locally generated content. It may be
> possible since X_ITE works with remote URLs in Jupyter.
> -Andreas
> ---on the phone---
> On Fri, May 31, 2019, 5:14 PM <x3d-public-request at web3d.org wrote:
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>> Today's Topics:
>>     1. Re: jupyter notebook; X3DOM syntax for including X3D within
>>        HTML/XHTML (Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV))
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 10:14:05 +0000
>> From: "Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV)" <brutzman at nps.edu>
>> To: "x3d-public at web3d.org" <x3d-public at web3d.org>
>> Subject: Re: [x3d-public] jupyter notebook; X3DOM syntax for including
>>          X3D within HTML/XHTML
>> Message-ID: <b6c49fa9-6afc-34fe-ee57-59f0ad5fc99d at nps.edu>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>> thanks for great progress.
>> On 5/28/2019 12:12 PM, Andreas Plesch wrote:
>>> - x3dom has a problem with generated X3D outside of an Inline because
>>> the serialized XML output uses self-closing tags such as <Material />
>>> which is not HTML compatible.
>> HTML allows singleton elements, i.e. self-closing tags.
>> Similarly, element CamelCaseElementNames are legal, so we should not have to rename <Material/> to <material></material> simply because of similarity to another language's naming patterns.
>> i think root of this problem likely lies in how X3DOM uses the accompanying DOM libraries - not sure of those details.
>> Note that I got *all* of the X_ITE and X3DOM examples to work with HTML by assigning scenes to .html and .xhtml respectively.
>> http://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dResources.html#Examples
>> http://x3dgraphics.com/examples/X3dForWebAuthors/Chapter01TechnicalOverview/HelloWorldIndex.html
>> http://x3dgraphics.com/examples/X3dForWebAuthors/Chapter01TechnicalOverview/HelloWorldX3dom.xhtml
>> http://x3dgraphics.com/examples/X3dForWebAuthors/Chapter01TechnicalOverview/HelloWorldX_ITE.html
>>> So the suggestion would be to provide a method, say
>>> x3d.toStringX3DClosingTags(), which generates explicit closing tags:
>>> <Material></Material>
>> I don't think it is good to propagate a side-effect fix (which encourages mysterious improper practices and hides path towards fixes).
>> Rather it is more desirable to isolate and fix the actual problem.  If someone can figure out why X3DOM runs differently when included within .xhtml and .html pages, that may reveal whatever idiosyncrasy is actually occurring.
>> Finally we want to match the same patterns in X_ITE and X3DOM so that choice of player is independent of source-model syntax when using X3D version 4.  So this is a worthy mismatch to figure out and fix.  Hopefully we can get closer to sorting things out fully.
>> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>> Meanwhile: found and fixed several errors in online X3DOM .xhtml examples:
>> - corrected url to match changed release address:
>>     https://x3dom.org/release/x3dom.css
>>     https://x3dom.org/release/x3dom-full.js
>> - fixed bug in X3dToX3dom.xslt code logic in order to include function toggleFullscreen ()
>> - using XHTML Transitional (vice Strict) DTD in order for anchor target attribute to pass validation
>>     https://stackoverflow.com/questions/4666523/xhtml-strict-1-0-target-blank-not-valid
>> X3dToX3dom.xslt stylesheet correction checked in, X3DOM example pages updated and uploaded.  Having fun with X3DOM!  8)
>> all the best, Don
>> --
>> Don Brutzman  Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br       brutzman at nps.edu
>> Watkins 270,  MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA   +1.831.656.2149
>> X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman
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all the best, Don
Don Brutzman  Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br       brutzman at nps.edu
Watkins 270,  MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA   +1.831.656.2149
X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman

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Holger Seelig
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