[x3d-public] [x3d] X3D meeting minutes 22 FEB 2019: X3D v4 Development status categories
Michalis Kamburelis
michalis.kambi at gmail.com
Fri Mar 1 08:15:07 PST 2019
Proposed to include in "Accepted":
"Make RGB and grayscale textures treatment consistent"
https://github.com/michaliskambi/x3d-tests/wiki/Make-RGB-and-grayscale-textures-treatment-consistent
pt., 1 mar 2019 o 14:27 Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV)
<brutzman at nps.edu> napisał(a):
>
> [Corrected date in subject line, otherwise unchanged]
>
> 0. *Attendance* Anita Havele, Michalis Kamburelis, Vince Marchetti, Nicholas Polys, Dick Puk, Don Brutzman
>
> All information in this email is releasable publicly, no separate member-only minutes this week.
>
> ----
>
> Members and invited experts are welcome. We are an open organization.
>
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> The X3D Graphics Working Group addresses all X3D specification issues and coordinates the technical development of future improvements.
> http://www.web3d.org/working-groups/x3d
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> ==================================
>
> 1.0 *Last week's minutes*
>
> [x3d-public] X3D meeting minutes 15 FEB 2019: glTF and X3Dv4 progress
> http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2019-February/010096.html
>
> 1.1 *Today's agenda*
>
> [x3d] X3D V4 Capabilities and classification; 22 FEB 2019 meeting agenda
> http://web3d.org/mailman/private/x3d_web3d.org/2019-February/007440.html
>
> ==================================
>
> 2. Anita has posted a new Privacy Policy for Web3D Consortium. Recommended reading.
>
> Web3D Consortium Privacy Policy
> http://www.web3d.org/privacy
>
> [x3d-public] [web3d-announce] Web3D Consortium's Privacy Policy
> http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2019-February/010134.html
>
> ==================================
>
> 3. *Changes to X3Dv4 Development page*
>
> http://www.web3d.org/wiki/index.php/X3D_version_4.0_Development
>
> Add sections as follows.
>
> === Accepted Capabilities ===
> Ready for further work: well defined in Mantis, github draft specification, implementation and evaluation can commence.
>
> * Annotations
> * HAnim v2
> * Lighting model: glTF and Physically Based Rendering (PBR)
> * Materials: improvements to Material and TwoSidedMaterial
> ** to make them modern (e.g. normal maps)
> ** consistent with PhysicalMaterial (e.g. texture slots inside Material).
> * Texturing - Projective Texture Mapping (PTM), Environment Lighting
> * PointProperties
> * Volume Rendering component extensions
> * Add Security Considerations section to each component.
>
> === Approved Capabilities ===
> Published in github draft specification, reviewed by Working Group, public, members Board.
>
> === Candidate Capabilities ===
> Under consideration.
>
> * Are we ready to pursue Shadows (and Light node modifications) once PBR is set?
> * Is anyone prepared to work on Enhanced Geospatial Component?
> * Sound component: web audio, spatialization improvements
> * GeoOrigin deprecation cancelled, fully restored/clarified?
>
> [plus remainder of topics]
>
> === Deferred Capabilities ===
> Not ready for X3Dv4 put perhaps in a later version.
>
> === Deprecated and Removed ===
> Legacy capabilities in X3Dv3.3 that get removed.
>
> === Excluded Capabilities ===
> Not recommended for inclusion.
>
> * Layout component - perhaps no longer needed, especially with HTML5 (and MAR) integration expected.
> * Shaders component - deserved close reconsideration.
>
> Problem: we were unable to save changes to this page, apparently due to issue arising from recent website upgrade. Webmaster notified.
>
> TODO: get permissions restored to satisfactorily edit page, then begin moving topics around as described here.
>
> http://www.web3d.org/wiki/index.php/X3D_version_4.0_Development
>
> ==================================
>
> 4. *Further additions*
>
> a. When updating these status categories on the development page, let's annotate each entry with 1-sentence status or rationale descriptions, such as the ones provided earlier by Vince below.
>
> ----
>
> b. Information to add, maintain spreadsheet that tracks support:
> X3D Node Inventory Comparison (.pdf) shows implementation coverage of the X3D Abstract Specification:
> Validation using X3D Schema, X3D DOCTYPE, and X3D Schematron;
> X3D Tooltips and VRML97 node sets; plus
> Selected open-source implementations: X3D-Edit, X3DOM, X_ITE, view3dscene (Castle Game Engine), Xj3D.
> http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dNodeInventoryComparison.xlsx
> http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dNodeInventoryComparison.pdf
>
> ----
>
> c. Discussion: put X3D-HTML5 integration in a new Annex in 19775-1 to see if that works. Much easier lift procedurally than starting a separate 19775-3 specification. Dick described tradeoffs. Seems like a good idea to put candidate text in an Annex before committing to a whole new specification.
>
> Of note: Roy created a draft 19775-3 in github for HTML5-X3D
> https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D/tree/master/ISO-IEC%2019775/ISO-IEC%2019775-3/ISO-IEC%2019775-3%20V4.0/ISO-IEC%2019775-3%20V4.0%20WD1
>
> Don and Dick will look at prior materials and create draft annex structure for HTML5-DOM in X3D Architecture 19775-1.
>
> ----
>
> d. Discussion: should we consider adding X3DUOM descriptive prose in Concepts section? It is becoming essential to confirming that node interfaces are well specified and implementable precisely/interoperably in various X3D file encodings and language bindings.
> - Summary: "X3DUOM fully defines all object-oriented relationships for nodes, fields and abstract interfaces in the X3D Architecture. X3DUOM is a validatable expression of X3D relationships that can be applied to implement various X3D file encodings and programming-language bindings."
> - http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3DUOM.html
>
> Don will draft some further spec prose (not exceptionally long) and post.
>
> ==================================
>
> 5. *Specification Production Timeline*
>
> Add new section to X3Dv4 development page:
>
> === Specification Production Timeline ===
>
> - links to guiding Web3D pages on spec strategy and process,
> - link to status tracking spreadsheet,
> - we effectively have a Web3D/ISO Working Draft (WD) now,
> - we continue adding components/nodes via working group process,
> - (currently) Mantis is where issues, draft spec functionality and design tradeoffs are captured, reviewed and approved,
> - Apply new prose sections in github spec repository (by Dick and I, many improvements occurred this week),
> - (suggested) *Web3D announces X3D v4 Working Draft availability at Web3D & SIGGRAPH 2019 conferences*,
> - TODO consider whether that is a public release to encourage engagement - or not.
> - Working Group continues to add nodes and components,
> - Excerpted draft spec and implementation details posted for public comment on a per-component basis ~monthly,
> - (suggested date) *Web3D announces plans to close additions to X3Dv4 on 16 DEC 2019*
> - +1 month, final public comments period and editorial work, member review, Board review and approval
> - Web3D submits New Work Item Proposal (NWIP) and Committee Draft (CD) to ISO
> - implement, evaluate examples, refine, resolve all related issues
> - (suggested date) *Web3D approves, submits X3Dv4 Draft International Spec DIS to ISO at Web3D 2020*
> - ISO dates/deadline for DIS/FDIS/IS proceed
> - Work begins on X3Dv4.1 Working Draft (WD)
>
> Nicholas noted that Khronos specification prose is edited "using github all the way" and we should consider that.
> Michalis has also had good experience with this approach to group editing of a specification.
>
> OK? We will work with one or two components as next step... walk before run... we don't want to lose Mantis details, we don't want to spend time converting in progress.
>
> Wondering: going forward, is a 1-year X3D version-update repetition cycle feasible? :0
>
> Suggested dates and pace of progress to be considered further.
>
> Discussion: releasing this information publicly - is there anything which cannot go on the dev page? We always have the option to split meeting minutes accordingly (public, member only). Group review agreed that public release is OK on all counts for this week's information.
>
> ==================================
>
> 6. *Tandem work*
>
> Keeping X3D Architecture coherent in all directions.
> http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dSpecificationRelationships.png
>
> Corresponding production of JSON, C/C++/C#, Python specifications (parts are autogenerated from X3DUOM).
>
> Corresponding production of Efficient X3D Encoding, to describe
> - X3D Canonical Form (possibly a slight refinement of existing spec)
> - W3C Efficient XML Interchange (EXI) compression
> - Practices for composing W3C XML Digital Signature (Authentication) and W3C XML Encryption (Privacy)
>
> Corresponding updates of 19775-2 SAI plus ECMA/JavaScript and Java language bindings.
>
> ==================================
>
> 7. *Upcoming work*
>
> a. Michalis is publishing his summary of proposed X3D specifications to X3D working group on Material improvements with Physically Based Rendering (PBR). Just received Friday morning:
>
> "Work-in-progress document: "Specification changes, to include PBR and related features"
> http://web3d.org/mailman/private/x3d_web3d.org/2019-February/007441.html
> ----
>
> b. Planned for next week: rename of directories in github specification trees to simplify slightly, omitting whitespace.
> https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D/
> https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D/tree/master/ISO-IEC%2019775/ISO-IEC%2019775-1/ISO-IEC%2019775-1%20V4.0/ISO-IEC%2019775-1%20V4.0%20WD1
>
> Also look at CSS stylesheets for consistency and highlighting/annotation of specification changes.
>
> ----
>
> c. Planned for next meeting: X3Dv4 design review: Web3D 2017/2018 session notes. Event model diagrams are found in prior X3Dv4 architecture presentations, potential refinement figure attached.
>
> "Future of X3D" presentation and detailed notes from Web3D 2017 Conference, Brisbane Australia, 7 June 2017.
> http://www.web3d.org/sites/default/files/page/X3D%20Version%204/FutureOfX3D.pdf
> http://www.web3d.org/sites/default/files/page/X3D%20Version%204/FutureOfX3dWeb3d2017June7.pdf
> http://www.web3d.org/sites/default/files/image/wg/X3D%20Version%204/PresentationPanoramaFutureOfX3dPaulGrimm20170607_135611.1600x492.jpg
>
> Based on discussions in Korea and preceding documents, Don has written a further-distilled diagram for HTML5/X3D event models. Essentially each (HTML5 and X3D) have internal event loops, and natural times to exchange event buffers occur at the each loop. As with current X3D specification, ordering is guaranteed for each successive timestamp but ordering is not deterministic or guaranteed within a single timestamp.
>
> Wondering: how have X3DOM and X_ITE each implemented events? What differences exist? Are ROUTE connections consistent? Also of note is that X3DOM is still missing some important simple Event Utility nodes.
>
> Please review as preparations for next meeting discussions.
>
> ----
>
> d. Planned for following meetings: Projective Texture Mapping (PTM), Shader component consideration, ongoing refinement of X3D 4.0 Development components and status spreadsheet.
>
> ==================================
>
> Wow, tremendous progress. We continue to take "giant steps" together. Very impressive, all comments and participation welcome.
>
> Having fun with X3Dv4! 8)
>
> all the best, Don
> --
> Don Brutzman Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br brutzman at nps.edu
> Watkins 270, MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA +1.831.656.2149
> X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman
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