[x3d-public] [x3d] X3D meeting minutes 22 FEB 2019: X3D v4 Development status categories
John Carlson
yottzumm at gmail.com
Fri Mar 1 13:46:30 PST 2019
As far as I know there is no Script “class” or source file in X3DOM, thus
no place to hang fields, thus nowhere to hook up routes. I did write one
at one time, it didn’t seem that difficult, but I’m not presently on board
to rewrite it. I suggest looking at other implementations of fields.
John
On Fri, Mar 1, 2019 at 7:27 AM Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV) <
brutzman at nps.edu> wrote:
> [Corrected date in subject line, otherwise unchanged]
>
> 0. *Attendance* Anita Havele, Michalis Kamburelis, Vince Marchetti,
> Nicholas Polys, Dick Puk, Don Brutzman
>
> All information in this email is releasable publicly, no separate
> member-only minutes this week.
>
> ----
>
> Members and invited experts are welcome. We are an open organization.
>
> We meet today, as usual, 0800-0930 pacific. To join the teleconference:
> Web3D Teleconference
> http://www.web3d.org/member/teleconference-information
>
> The X3D Graphics Working Group addresses all X3D specification issues and
> coordinates the technical development of future improvements.
> http://www.web3d.org/working-groups/x3d
>
> Each week we report out both public and member-only information -
> membership has value. To become a Web3D Consortium member:
> Join the Web3D Consortium
> http://www.web3d.org/join
>
> ==================================
>
> 1.0 *Last week's minutes*
>
> [x3d-public] X3D meeting minutes 15 FEB 2019: glTF and X3Dv4 progress
> http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2019-February/010096.html
>
> 1.1 *Today's agenda*
>
> [x3d] X3D V4 Capabilities and classification; 22 FEB 2019 meeting agenda
> http://web3d.org/mailman/private/x3d_web3d.org/2019-February/007440.html
>
> ==================================
>
> 2. Anita has posted a new Privacy Policy for Web3D Consortium. Recommended
> reading.
>
> Web3D Consortium Privacy Policy
> http://www.web3d.org/privacy
>
> [x3d-public] [web3d-announce] Web3D Consortium's Privacy Policy
> http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2019-February/010134.html
>
> ==================================
>
> 3. *Changes to X3Dv4 Development page*
>
> http://www.web3d.org/wiki/index.php/X3D_version_4.0_Development
>
> Add sections as follows.
>
> === Accepted Capabilities ===
> Ready for further work: well defined in Mantis, github draft
> specification, implementation and evaluation can commence.
>
> * Annotations
> * HAnim v2
> * Lighting model: glTF and Physically Based Rendering (PBR)
> * Materials: improvements to Material and TwoSidedMaterial
> ** to make them modern (e.g. normal maps)
> ** consistent with PhysicalMaterial (e.g. texture slots inside Material).
> * Texturing - Projective Texture Mapping (PTM), Environment Lighting
> * PointProperties
> * Volume Rendering component extensions
> * Add Security Considerations section to each component.
>
> === Approved Capabilities ===
> Published in github draft specification, reviewed by Working Group,
> public, members Board.
>
> === Candidate Capabilities ===
> Under consideration.
>
> * Are we ready to pursue Shadows (and Light node modifications) once PBR
> is set?
> * Is anyone prepared to work on Enhanced Geospatial Component?
> * Sound component: web audio, spatialization improvements
> * GeoOrigin deprecation cancelled, fully restored/clarified?
>
> [plus remainder of topics]
>
> === Deferred Capabilities ===
> Not ready for X3Dv4 put perhaps in a later version.
>
> === Deprecated and Removed ===
> Legacy capabilities in X3Dv3.3 that get removed.
>
> === Excluded Capabilities ===
> Not recommended for inclusion.
>
> * Layout component - perhaps no longer needed, especially with HTML5 (and
> MAR) integration expected.
> * Shaders component - deserved close reconsideration.
>
> Problem: we were unable to save changes to this page, apparently due to
> issue arising from recent website upgrade. Webmaster notified.
>
> TODO: get permissions restored to satisfactorily edit page, then begin
> moving topics around as described here.
>
> http://www.web3d.org/wiki/index.php/X3D_version_4.0_Development
>
> ==================================
>
> 4. *Further additions*
>
> a. When updating these status categories on the development page, let's
> annotate each entry with 1-sentence status or rationale descriptions, such
> as the ones provided earlier by Vince below.
>
> ----
>
> b. Information to add, maintain spreadsheet that tracks support:
> X3D Node Inventory Comparison (.pdf) shows implementation
> coverage of the X3D Abstract Specification:
> Validation using X3D Schema, X3D DOCTYPE, and X3D Schematron;
> X3D Tooltips and VRML97 node sets; plus
> Selected open-source implementations: X3D-Edit, X3DOM, X_ITE,
> view3dscene (Castle Game Engine), Xj3D.
>
> http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dNodeInventoryComparison.xlsx
>
> http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dNodeInventoryComparison.pdf
>
> ----
>
> c. Discussion: put X3D-HTML5 integration in a new Annex in 19775-1 to see
> if that works. Much easier lift procedurally than starting a separate
> 19775-3 specification. Dick described tradeoffs. Seems like a good idea
> to put candidate text in an Annex before committing to a whole new
> specification.
>
> Of note: Roy created a draft 19775-3 in github for HTML5-X3D
>
> https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D/tree/master/ISO-IEC%2019775/ISO-IEC%2019775-3/ISO-IEC%2019775-3%20V4.0/ISO-IEC%2019775-3%20V4.0%20WD1
>
> Don and Dick will look at prior materials and create draft annex structure
> for HTML5-DOM in X3D Architecture 19775-1.
>
> ----
>
> d. Discussion: should we consider adding X3DUOM descriptive prose in
> Concepts section? It is becoming essential to confirming that node
> interfaces are well specified and implementable precisely/interoperably in
> various X3D file encodings and language bindings.
> - Summary: "X3DUOM fully defines all object-oriented relationships for
> nodes, fields and abstract interfaces in the X3D Architecture. X3DUOM is a
> validatable expression of X3D relationships that can be applied to
> implement various X3D file encodings and programming-language bindings."
> - http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3DUOM.html
>
> Don will draft some further spec prose (not exceptionally long) and post.
>
> ==================================
>
> 5. *Specification Production Timeline*
>
> Add new section to X3Dv4 development page:
>
> === Specification Production Timeline ===
>
> - links to guiding Web3D pages on spec strategy and process,
> - link to status tracking spreadsheet,
> - we effectively have a Web3D/ISO Working Draft (WD) now,
> - we continue adding components/nodes via working group process,
> - (currently) Mantis is where issues, draft spec functionality and design
> tradeoffs are captured, reviewed and approved,
> - Apply new prose sections in github spec repository (by Dick and I, many
> improvements occurred this week),
> - (suggested) *Web3D announces X3D v4 Working Draft availability at Web3D
> & SIGGRAPH 2019 conferences*,
> - TODO consider whether that is a public release to encourage engagement -
> or not.
> - Working Group continues to add nodes and components,
> - Excerpted draft spec and implementation details posted for public
> comment on a per-component basis ~monthly,
> - (suggested date) *Web3D announces plans to close additions to X3Dv4 on
> 16 DEC 2019*
> - +1 month, final public comments period and editorial work, member
> review, Board review and approval
> - Web3D submits New Work Item Proposal (NWIP) and Committee Draft (CD) to
> ISO
> - implement, evaluate examples, refine, resolve all related issues
> - (suggested date) *Web3D approves, submits X3Dv4 Draft International Spec
> DIS to ISO at Web3D 2020*
> - ISO dates/deadline for DIS/FDIS/IS proceed
> - Work begins on X3Dv4.1 Working Draft (WD)
>
> Nicholas noted that Khronos specification prose is edited "using github
> all the way" and we should consider that.
> Michalis has also had good experience with this approach to group editing
> of a specification.
>
> OK? We will work with one or two components as next step... walk before
> run... we don't want to lose Mantis details, we don't want to spend time
> converting in progress.
>
> Wondering: going forward, is a 1-year X3D version-update repetition cycle
> feasible? :0
>
> Suggested dates and pace of progress to be considered further.
>
> Discussion: releasing this information publicly - is there anything which
> cannot go on the dev page? We always have the option to split meeting
> minutes accordingly (public, member only). Group review agreed that public
> release is OK on all counts for this week's information.
>
> ==================================
>
> 6. *Tandem work*
>
> Keeping X3D Architecture coherent in all directions.
> http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dSpecificationRelationships.png
>
> Corresponding production of JSON, C/C++/C#, Python specifications (parts
> are autogenerated from X3DUOM).
>
> Corresponding production of Efficient X3D Encoding, to describe
> - X3D Canonical Form (possibly a slight refinement of existing spec)
> - W3C Efficient XML Interchange (EXI) compression
> - Practices for composing W3C XML Digital Signature (Authentication) and
> W3C XML Encryption (Privacy)
>
> Corresponding updates of 19775-2 SAI plus ECMA/JavaScript and Java
> language bindings.
>
> ==================================
>
> 7. *Upcoming work*
>
> a. Michalis is publishing his summary of proposed X3D specifications to
> X3D working group on Material improvements with Physically Based Rendering
> (PBR). Just received Friday morning:
>
> "Work-in-progress document: "Specification changes, to include PBR
> and related features"
>
> http://web3d.org/mailman/private/x3d_web3d.org/2019-February/007441.html
> ----
>
> b. Planned for next week: rename of directories in github specification
> trees to simplify slightly, omitting whitespace.
> https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D/
>
> https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D/tree/master/ISO-IEC%2019775/ISO-IEC%2019775-1/ISO-IEC%2019775-1%20V4.0/ISO-IEC%2019775-1%20V4.0%20WD1
>
> Also look at CSS stylesheets for consistency and highlighting/annotation
> of specification changes.
>
> ----
>
> c. Planned for next meeting: X3Dv4 design review: Web3D 2017/2018 session
> notes. Event model diagrams are found in prior X3Dv4 architecture
> presentations, potential refinement figure attached.
>
> "Future of X3D" presentation and detailed notes from Web3D 2017
> Conference, Brisbane Australia, 7 June 2017.
>
> http://www.web3d.org/sites/default/files/page/X3D%20Version%204/FutureOfX3D.pdf
>
> http://www.web3d.org/sites/default/files/page/X3D%20Version%204/FutureOfX3dWeb3d2017June7.pdf
>
> http://www.web3d.org/sites/default/files/image/wg/X3D%20Version%204/PresentationPanoramaFutureOfX3dPaulGrimm20170607_135611.1600x492.jpg
>
> Based on discussions in Korea and preceding documents, Don has written a
> further-distilled diagram for HTML5/X3D event models. Essentially each
> (HTML5 and X3D) have internal event loops, and natural times to exchange
> event buffers occur at the each loop. As with current X3D specification,
> ordering is guaranteed for each successive timestamp but ordering is not
> deterministic or guaranteed within a single timestamp.
>
> Wondering: how have X3DOM and X_ITE each implemented events? What
> differences exist? Are ROUTE connections consistent? Also of note is that
> X3DOM is still missing some important simple Event Utility nodes.
>
> Please review as preparations for next meeting discussions.
>
> ----
>
> d. Planned for following meetings: Projective Texture Mapping (PTM),
> Shader component consideration, ongoing refinement of X3D 4.0 Development
> components and status spreadsheet.
>
> ==================================
>
> Wow, tremendous progress. We continue to take "giant steps" together.
> Very impressive, all comments and participation welcome.
>
> Having fun with X3Dv4! 8)
>
> all the best, Don
> --
> Don Brutzman Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br
> brutzman at nps.edu
> Watkins 270, MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA +1.831.656.2149
> X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics
> http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman
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>
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