[x3d-public] [x3d] X3D meeting minutes 22 FEB 2019: X3D v4 Development status categories
John Carlson
yottzumm at gmail.com
Fri Mar 1 14:03:22 PST 2019
In other words, scripts (really script fields) do not appear in DOM and do
not receive or generate DOM events.
John
On Fri, Mar 1, 2019 at 3:46 PM John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com> wrote:
> As far as I know there is no Script “class” or source file in X3DOM, thus
> no place to hang fields, thus nowhere to hook up routes. I did write one
> at one time, it didn’t seem that difficult, but I’m not presently on board
> to rewrite it. I suggest looking at other implementations of fields.
>
> John
>
> On Fri, Mar 1, 2019 at 7:27 AM Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV) <
> brutzman at nps.edu> wrote:
>
>> [Corrected date in subject line, otherwise unchanged]
>>
>> 0. *Attendance* Anita Havele, Michalis Kamburelis, Vince Marchetti,
>> Nicholas Polys, Dick Puk, Don Brutzman
>>
>> All information in this email is releasable publicly, no separate
>> member-only minutes this week.
>>
>> ----
>>
>> Members and invited experts are welcome. We are an open organization.
>>
>> We meet today, as usual, 0800-0930 pacific. To join the teleconference:
>> Web3D Teleconference
>> http://www.web3d.org/member/teleconference-information
>>
>> The X3D Graphics Working Group addresses all X3D specification issues and
>> coordinates the technical development of future improvements.
>> http://www.web3d.org/working-groups/x3d
>>
>> Each week we report out both public and member-only information -
>> membership has value. To become a Web3D Consortium member:
>> Join the Web3D Consortium
>> http://www.web3d.org/join
>>
>> ==================================
>>
>> 1.0 *Last week's minutes*
>>
>> [x3d-public] X3D meeting minutes 15 FEB 2019: glTF and X3Dv4 progress
>> http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2019-February/010096.html
>>
>> 1.1 *Today's agenda*
>>
>> [x3d] X3D V4 Capabilities and classification; 22 FEB 2019 meeting agenda
>> http://web3d.org/mailman/private/x3d_web3d.org/2019-February/007440.html
>>
>> ==================================
>>
>> 2. Anita has posted a new Privacy Policy for Web3D Consortium.
>> Recommended reading.
>>
>> Web3D Consortium Privacy Policy
>> http://www.web3d.org/privacy
>>
>> [x3d-public] [web3d-announce] Web3D Consortium's Privacy Policy
>> http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2019-February/010134.html
>>
>> ==================================
>>
>> 3. *Changes to X3Dv4 Development page*
>>
>> http://www.web3d.org/wiki/index.php/X3D_version_4.0_Development
>>
>> Add sections as follows.
>>
>> === Accepted Capabilities ===
>> Ready for further work: well defined in Mantis, github draft
>> specification, implementation and evaluation can commence.
>>
>> * Annotations
>> * HAnim v2
>> * Lighting model: glTF and Physically Based Rendering (PBR)
>> * Materials: improvements to Material and TwoSidedMaterial
>> ** to make them modern (e.g. normal maps)
>> ** consistent with PhysicalMaterial (e.g. texture slots inside Material).
>> * Texturing - Projective Texture Mapping (PTM), Environment Lighting
>> * PointProperties
>> * Volume Rendering component extensions
>> * Add Security Considerations section to each component.
>>
>> === Approved Capabilities ===
>> Published in github draft specification, reviewed by Working Group,
>> public, members Board.
>>
>> === Candidate Capabilities ===
>> Under consideration.
>>
>> * Are we ready to pursue Shadows (and Light node modifications) once PBR
>> is set?
>> * Is anyone prepared to work on Enhanced Geospatial Component?
>> * Sound component: web audio, spatialization improvements
>> * GeoOrigin deprecation cancelled, fully restored/clarified?
>>
>> [plus remainder of topics]
>>
>> === Deferred Capabilities ===
>> Not ready for X3Dv4 put perhaps in a later version.
>>
>> === Deprecated and Removed ===
>> Legacy capabilities in X3Dv3.3 that get removed.
>>
>> === Excluded Capabilities ===
>> Not recommended for inclusion.
>>
>> * Layout component - perhaps no longer needed, especially with HTML5 (and
>> MAR) integration expected.
>> * Shaders component - deserved close reconsideration.
>>
>> Problem: we were unable to save changes to this page, apparently due to
>> issue arising from recent website upgrade. Webmaster notified.
>>
>> TODO: get permissions restored to satisfactorily edit page, then begin
>> moving topics around as described here.
>>
>> http://www.web3d.org/wiki/index.php/X3D_version_4.0_Development
>>
>> ==================================
>>
>> 4. *Further additions*
>>
>> a. When updating these status categories on the development page, let's
>> annotate each entry with 1-sentence status or rationale descriptions, such
>> as the ones provided earlier by Vince below.
>>
>> ----
>>
>> b. Information to add, maintain spreadsheet that tracks support:
>> X3D Node Inventory Comparison (.pdf) shows implementation
>> coverage of the X3D Abstract Specification:
>> Validation using X3D Schema, X3D DOCTYPE, and X3D Schematron;
>> X3D Tooltips and VRML97 node sets; plus
>> Selected open-source implementations: X3D-Edit, X3DOM,
>> X_ITE, view3dscene (Castle Game Engine), Xj3D.
>>
>> http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dNodeInventoryComparison.xlsx
>>
>> http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dNodeInventoryComparison.pdf
>>
>> ----
>>
>> c. Discussion: put X3D-HTML5 integration in a new Annex in 19775-1 to see
>> if that works. Much easier lift procedurally than starting a separate
>> 19775-3 specification. Dick described tradeoffs. Seems like a good idea
>> to put candidate text in an Annex before committing to a whole new
>> specification.
>>
>> Of note: Roy created a draft 19775-3 in github for HTML5-X3D
>>
>> https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D/tree/master/ISO-IEC%2019775/ISO-IEC%2019775-3/ISO-IEC%2019775-3%20V4.0/ISO-IEC%2019775-3%20V4.0%20WD1
>>
>> Don and Dick will look at prior materials and create draft annex
>> structure for HTML5-DOM in X3D Architecture 19775-1.
>>
>> ----
>>
>> d. Discussion: should we consider adding X3DUOM descriptive prose in
>> Concepts section? It is becoming essential to confirming that node
>> interfaces are well specified and implementable precisely/interoperably in
>> various X3D file encodings and language bindings.
>> - Summary: "X3DUOM fully defines all object-oriented relationships for
>> nodes, fields and abstract interfaces in the X3D Architecture. X3DUOM is a
>> validatable expression of X3D relationships that can be applied to
>> implement various X3D file encodings and programming-language bindings."
>> - http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3DUOM.html
>>
>> Don will draft some further spec prose (not exceptionally long) and post.
>>
>> ==================================
>>
>> 5. *Specification Production Timeline*
>>
>> Add new section to X3Dv4 development page:
>>
>> === Specification Production Timeline ===
>>
>> - links to guiding Web3D pages on spec strategy and process,
>> - link to status tracking spreadsheet,
>> - we effectively have a Web3D/ISO Working Draft (WD) now,
>> - we continue adding components/nodes via working group process,
>> - (currently) Mantis is where issues, draft spec functionality and design
>> tradeoffs are captured, reviewed and approved,
>> - Apply new prose sections in github spec repository (by Dick and I, many
>> improvements occurred this week),
>> - (suggested) *Web3D announces X3D v4 Working Draft availability at Web3D
>> & SIGGRAPH 2019 conferences*,
>> - TODO consider whether that is a public release to encourage engagement
>> - or not.
>> - Working Group continues to add nodes and components,
>> - Excerpted draft spec and implementation details posted for public
>> comment on a per-component basis ~monthly,
>> - (suggested date) *Web3D announces plans to close additions to X3Dv4 on
>> 16 DEC 2019*
>> - +1 month, final public comments period and editorial work, member
>> review, Board review and approval
>> - Web3D submits New Work Item Proposal (NWIP) and Committee Draft (CD) to
>> ISO
>> - implement, evaluate examples, refine, resolve all related issues
>> - (suggested date) *Web3D approves, submits X3Dv4 Draft International
>> Spec DIS to ISO at Web3D 2020*
>> - ISO dates/deadline for DIS/FDIS/IS proceed
>> - Work begins on X3Dv4.1 Working Draft (WD)
>>
>> Nicholas noted that Khronos specification prose is edited "using github
>> all the way" and we should consider that.
>> Michalis has also had good experience with this approach to group editing
>> of a specification.
>>
>> OK? We will work with one or two components as next step... walk before
>> run... we don't want to lose Mantis details, we don't want to spend time
>> converting in progress.
>>
>> Wondering: going forward, is a 1-year X3D version-update repetition cycle
>> feasible? :0
>>
>> Suggested dates and pace of progress to be considered further.
>>
>> Discussion: releasing this information publicly - is there anything which
>> cannot go on the dev page? We always have the option to split meeting
>> minutes accordingly (public, member only). Group review agreed that public
>> release is OK on all counts for this week's information.
>>
>> ==================================
>>
>> 6. *Tandem work*
>>
>> Keeping X3D Architecture coherent in all directions.
>> http://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dSpecificationRelationships.png
>>
>> Corresponding production of JSON, C/C++/C#, Python specifications (parts
>> are autogenerated from X3DUOM).
>>
>> Corresponding production of Efficient X3D Encoding, to describe
>> - X3D Canonical Form (possibly a slight refinement of existing spec)
>> - W3C Efficient XML Interchange (EXI) compression
>> - Practices for composing W3C XML Digital Signature (Authentication) and
>> W3C XML Encryption (Privacy)
>>
>> Corresponding updates of 19775-2 SAI plus ECMA/JavaScript and Java
>> language bindings.
>>
>> ==================================
>>
>> 7. *Upcoming work*
>>
>> a. Michalis is publishing his summary of proposed X3D specifications to
>> X3D working group on Material improvements with Physically Based Rendering
>> (PBR). Just received Friday morning:
>>
>> "Work-in-progress document: "Specification changes, to include
>> PBR and related features"
>>
>> http://web3d.org/mailman/private/x3d_web3d.org/2019-February/007441.html
>> ----
>>
>> b. Planned for next week: rename of directories in github specification
>> trees to simplify slightly, omitting whitespace.
>> https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D/
>>
>> https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D/tree/master/ISO-IEC%2019775/ISO-IEC%2019775-1/ISO-IEC%2019775-1%20V4.0/ISO-IEC%2019775-1%20V4.0%20WD1
>>
>> Also look at CSS stylesheets for consistency and highlighting/annotation
>> of specification changes.
>>
>> ----
>>
>> c. Planned for next meeting: X3Dv4 design review: Web3D 2017/2018 session
>> notes. Event model diagrams are found in prior X3Dv4 architecture
>> presentations, potential refinement figure attached.
>>
>> "Future of X3D" presentation and detailed notes from Web3D 2017
>> Conference, Brisbane Australia, 7 June 2017.
>>
>> http://www.web3d.org/sites/default/files/page/X3D%20Version%204/FutureOfX3D.pdf
>>
>> http://www.web3d.org/sites/default/files/page/X3D%20Version%204/FutureOfX3dWeb3d2017June7.pdf
>>
>> http://www.web3d.org/sites/default/files/image/wg/X3D%20Version%204/PresentationPanoramaFutureOfX3dPaulGrimm20170607_135611.1600x492.jpg
>>
>> Based on discussions in Korea and preceding documents, Don has written a
>> further-distilled diagram for HTML5/X3D event models. Essentially each
>> (HTML5 and X3D) have internal event loops, and natural times to exchange
>> event buffers occur at the each loop. As with current X3D specification,
>> ordering is guaranteed for each successive timestamp but ordering is not
>> deterministic or guaranteed within a single timestamp.
>>
>> Wondering: how have X3DOM and X_ITE each implemented events? What
>> differences exist? Are ROUTE connections consistent? Also of note is that
>> X3DOM is still missing some important simple Event Utility nodes.
>>
>> Please review as preparations for next meeting discussions.
>>
>> ----
>>
>> d. Planned for following meetings: Projective Texture Mapping (PTM),
>> Shader component consideration, ongoing refinement of X3D 4.0 Development
>> components and status spreadsheet.
>>
>> ==================================
>>
>> Wow, tremendous progress. We continue to take "giant steps" together.
>> Very impressive, all comments and participation welcome.
>>
>> Having fun with X3Dv4! 8)
>>
>> all the best, Don
>> --
>> Don Brutzman Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br
>> brutzman at nps.edu
>> Watkins 270, MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA
>> +1.831.656.2149
>> X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics
>> http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman
>> _______________________________________________
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>>
>
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