[x3d-public] [x3dom-users] Whither protoexpander in X3DOM? umm, just define input-to-output and write code

[John Carlson]

Don suggested a Switch node at one point (thanks Don).

On Fri, May 29, 2020 at 1:28 PM Andreas Plesch <andreasplesch at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Internal namescopes and better parsing made nested ProtoDeclares
> inside ProtoBody and internal ROUTEs work:
>
> https://andreasplesch.github.io/x3dom/test/functional/proto/inline.html
>
> https://5ed144877a8ae8000756ddd1--x3dom.netlify.app/examples/functional/proto/inline.html
>
> I am still not sure how to think about multiple nodes in a ProtoBody
> template since these are not scenes. Many examples seem to have only
> one node, and only routes outside of it.
>
> Conceptually, it is pretty clear that the first node is THE node, and
> other nodes do not render but are active and can be connected.
>
> Let's look at the Material Modulator example:
>
> http://x3dgraphics.com/examples/X3dForWebAuthors/Chapter14Prototypes/MaterialModulatorIndex.html
>
> The main node is the Material node but then there are Script and
> TimeSensor siblings, and routes.
>
> So the instance will be of Material node kind, an
> X3DAppearanceChildNode. This allows the instance to be accepted as a
> value of the Material field in an Appearance node.
>
> But the Script and TimeSensor sibling instances will not be able to
> continue to live as siblings next to the instanced Material node since
> they are not X3DAppearanceChildNodes. They will need to live somewhere
> else but still be able to control the instanced Material node.
>
> So a straight transfer of a one to one instance to the scene seems out
> of the question.
>
> I kind of hope I am missing something ? Is there another way to think
> about Protoinstances ?
>
> Probably time to look at other code for inspiration.
>
> -Andreas
>
> On Fri, May 29, 2020 at 8:39 AM Andreas Plesch <andreasplesch at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > I added a few more Proto test examples to
> >
> > https://andreasplesch.github.io/x3dom/test/functional/proto/inline.html
> >
> > and
> >
> >
> https://5ed100c873166e0006438ab0--x3dom.netlify.app/examples/functional/proto/inline.html
> >
> > That includes a NIST example which uses internal routing and one which
> > has ProtoDeclare inside ProtoBody, nested five deep. These are good
> > targets to get to work before thinking about fields and interface.
> >
> >
> https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/ConformanceNist/Miscellaneous/PROTO/index.html
> >
> > -Andreas
> >
> > On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 8:35 PM Andreas Plesch <andreasplesch at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > It turns out that github pages does not like serving all the little js
> > > files making up x3dom separately.
> > >
> > > Here is a complete build with the example:
> > >
> > >
> https://5ed055bd4da4fa0007bf3d0a--x3dom.netlify.app/examples/functional/proto/inline.html
> > >
> > > -Andreas
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 6:43 PM Andreas Plesch <
> andreasplesch at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I could not resist a proof of concept for the subgraph inclusion
> part of Protos.
> > > >
> > > >
> https://andreasplesch.github.io/x3dom/test/functional/proto/inline.html
> > > >
> > > > This is an absolutely minimal start. There is only creation of
> > > > instances, using only the first element in the ProtoBody. There is no
> > > > ProtoInterface or events handling.
> > > > It should work for all single node Protos.
> > > >
> > > > But it only took a few lines in the right place
> > > > (
> https://github.com/andreasplesch/x3dom/commit/1e0ff82c2f7c77adcb521d62ff5172cf159943fb
> ).
> > > >
> > > > I understand that only the first node in a ProtoBody is used for the
> > > > template. It can be of course a grouping node. Other nodes in the
> > > > ProtoBody can affect the first node with internal routing.
> > > >
> > > > Inline is in effect a grouping node but this will not translate to
> > > > ProtoInstance. I will have to look at more examples to understand
> > > > better how multiple nodes are inserted with a single ProtoInstance.
> > > >
> > > > -Andreas
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 3:09 PM Andreas Plesch <
> andreasplesch at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Let me write down a few notes on ProtoDeclare/Instance.
> > > > >
> > > > > - The expander approach would be ok for x3dom as well but I am not
> > > > > sure if it is easier to implement.
> > > > > - These are Statements and would be handled separately from Nodes,
> > > > > similar to ROUTE, in x3dom in NodeNameSpace.js
> > > > > - in x3dom gltf inlines are handled by translation to a (by default
> > > > > non-accessible) sub DOM, which is then tree parsed and added as a
> > > > > subgraph in a child namespace to the main scene. Similar to
> > > > > ProtoInstance this involves some processing before attaching to the
> > > > > main scene. So I think it would be not too hard to do the same for
> > > > > ProtoInstance by looking up the corresponding ProtoBody in a
> registry.
> > > > > The registry is populated while parsing, looking for ProtoDeclare
> > > > > elements.
> > > > > - the main challenge is how to implement custom fields, and 'IS'
> ing.
> > > > > For routing to ProtoInstances there needs to be a crossing of the
> > > > > namescope boundary.
> > > > > - ProtoInstances are more like Nodes than Statements, since they
> need
> > > > > to be included in traversing the scene.
> > > > > - not sure if x3dom currently has a way to send events into
> namescoped
> > > > > subgraphs (via IS/connect), and capture events from those (via
> > > > > IS/connect).
> > > > > - perhaps it makes sense to have the ProtoInstance statement
> construct
> > > > > a ProtoInstanceNode node to insert in the scenegraph. The statement
> > > > > takes care of field definitions for the node, and the node takes
> care
> > > > > of ISing and events during travesal.
> > > > >
> > > > > -Andreas
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 12:52 AM John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > so perhaps this is the reasoning Leonard had.:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Developers and designers want the full power of the web.   If I
> restrict people to inlines, they can’t use standard tools to inspect the
> DOM, especially where it’s critical.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 1.   Should X3D4 allow all X3D elements in the HTML page or
> perhaps just a few?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 2.  Should X3D4 allow Protos on the main HTML page?  Or only in
> inlines?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > John
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Andreas Plesch
> > > > > Waltham, MA 02453
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Andreas Plesch
> > > > Waltham, MA 02453
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Andreas Plesch
> > > Waltham, MA 02453
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Andreas Plesch
> > Waltham, MA 02453
>
>
>
> --
> Andreas Plesch
> Waltham, MA 02453
>
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