[x3d-public] announce: X3D4 updates

Thu Oct 15 10:09:06 PDT 2020

I understand the foibles of x3d's html derivatives. I can deal with those, because they go with the territory.
x3d conversions on the other hand shouldn't be having the hair pulling nonsense I have seen.
I try to get my vrml files working as x3d first before attempting those.

There's a very good reason you wished me good luck. I am going to need it.
But I shouldn't have to need luck with a format whose movers and shakers think its ready to move on to the next level.

I have the validator you suggested. The files it claims has errors will work, so how do I know which errors are "legitimate" and which errors are simply something Xj3D will turn its nose up at like my cats and their food?

-----Original Message-----
From: John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com>
To: Russ Kinter <pyth7 at verizon.net>
Cc: brutzman at nps.edu <brutzman at nps.edu>; x3d-public at web3d.org <x3d-public at web3d.org>
Sent: Thu, Oct 15, 2020 12:38 pm
Subject: Re: [x3d-public] announce: X3D4 updates

Russ,
You should check the files with a validator for errors. https://savage.nps.edu/X3dValidator/  Or use NetBeans/X3D-Edit. If you convert your files to JSON. I find the validators very useful!
I mostly use X3DOM and X_ITE for rendering.
Good luck!
John  
On Thu, Oct 15, 2020 at 11:22 AM Russ Kinter <pyth7 at verizon.net> wrote:

 X3D4?

Might I suggest you ought to get x3d right in its current version first?
Am trying to convert old complex VRML files that worked in major browsers to x3d.
I convert a .wrl file in Bitmanagement Contact to x3d and it won't load the resulting file claiming there are errors in the file that itself made.
Instant Player won't load it claiming errors.
Output from Octaga has the same problem.FreeWRL? My sense of humor only goes so far.XJ3d? Not even gonna try.

You should rename it "Babel". That's certainly more descriptive.

Sincerely,
Snarky Troll in Residence

-----Original Message-----
From: John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com>
To: Don Brutzman <brutzman at nps.edu>
Cc: X3D Graphics public mailing list <x3d-public at web3d.org>
Sent: Thu, Oct 15, 2020 11:50 am
Subject: Re: [x3d-public] announce: X3D4 updates

Standards-compliant x3dom Script tag offered on my x3dom Script branch.   Please make Sample branch work as well as master branch for the Gears example  (get to "innerRadius" error, or at least get console messages in Script.js working), which uses X3DScript.
https://github.com/coderextreme/x3dom/tree/Script

https://github.com/coderextreme/x3dom/tree/Script/test/functional/Gears

I know very well you can get X_ITE Script node working, no need to show examples of that.
Probably my issues with script and field were logged a long time ago and not addressed then.    Are we going to address them now?
If you want to use "<script" along with "<field" in the context of HTML5, I'm pretty sure you'll have to address it with the web browser vendors and W3C. The problem, I believe, is that there are no tag children to script in HTML5.

If you want more details, I suggest searching backwards through the posts for the last time I was implementing Script in x3dom--Nobody wanted to address it then.
I believe the issue was something like Script could not be an X3DOM node.  That is, we can't create a new Script node in X3DOM, because HTML5 consumes script--there's no way to override the script node, because that would likely break basic web security.  What we might be able to do is implement a new script language, like Brython does.  https://brython.info/static_doc/en/intro.html  X_ITE has another way of handling Scripts with eval, so it doesn't have to put the Script tag in the DOM.  X3DOM is different, the script tag appears in the DOM.
If someone is interested in exploring how to create a new web scripting language (with field tags), we can explore that.
(waits patiently)
John
On Thu, Oct 15, 2020 at 1:51 AM Don Brutzman <brutzman at nps.edu> wrote:

"X3DScript" is non standard and will not be included in the X3D specification.

It may be a useful hack to get X3DOM to coexist in a well-behaved way with HTML.  Should simply debugging a lot, eliminating ambiguity to get things working.

Once it is working, we can then address how to let X3DOM be in charge of all Script nodes within an X3D scene.

If no one can get X3DOM to handle it, it simply remains a curious noncompliant deviation from X3D.

p.s. Gee we got Script working in 1997, didn't seem so hard then.  Hopefully you can get X3DScript working now, that is most of the work.

On 10/14/2020 7:47 PM, John Carlson wrote:
> 
> Don’t forget to add X3DScript as previously mentioned.  Note I don’t expect X3DOM to support Script node for backwards compatibility.
> 
> John
> 
> 
> On Wed, Oct 14, 2020 at 7:03 PM Don Brutzman <brutzman at nps.edu <mailto:brutzman at nps.edu>> wrote:
> 
>     I have updated X3D4 nodes and fields and documentation to support all changes for Physically Based Rendering (PBR) and glTF, plus most changes for Projective Texture Mapping (PTM).
> 
>     a. X3D XML Schema and DOCTYPE
>     b. X3D Unified Object Model (X3DUOM)
>     https://www.web3d.org/specifications/
> 
>     c. X3DJSAIL: X3D Java Scene Access Interface Library
>     http://www.web3d.org/specifications/java/X3DJSAIL.html
> 
>     d. X3DPSAIL (Python X3D Package)
>     https://pypi.org/project/x3d/
>     https://www.web3d.org/x3d/stylesheets/python/python.html
> 
>     e. X3D Ontology (Turtle)
>     https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/semantics/semantics.html
> 
>     f. X3D JSON
>     https://www.web3d.org/x3d/stylesheets/X3dToJson.html
> 
>     g. X3D Tooltips
>     https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/X3dTooltips.html
> 
>     h. X3D Validator
>     https://savage.nps.edu/X3dValidator/
> 
>     i. X3D Specification (github), editorial smoothing continues
>     https://github.com/Web3DConsortium
> 
>     Needless to say, it takes a lot of cross-checking to get all this to hang together.  That is good, high reliability.
> 
>     Everything is published and checked into version control, along with build output logs for comparison.
> 
>     Next, I expect one more X3D4 update prior to Web3D 2020 Conference:
> 
>     - Sound component updates for W3C Audio API,
>     - A few more hanges to PTM (texture transform, X3DLightingNode) resolution planned for this friday
>     - shadowIntensity, in or out?
> 
>     At that point we will have the entire infrastructure needed to support all X3D4 implementation capabilities.  No really.
> 
>     All feedback and testing welcome.  Have fun with X3D4!  8)
> 
>     all the best, Don
>     -- 
>     Don Brutzman  Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br brutzman at nps.edu <mailto:brutzman at nps.edu>
>     Watkins 270,  MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA   +1.831.656.2149
>     X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman
> 
>     _______________________________________________
>     x3d-public mailing list
>     x3d-public at web3d.org <mailto:x3d-public at web3d.org>
>     http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org
> 

all the best, Don
-- 
Don Brutzman  Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br       brutzman at nps.edu
Watkins 270,  MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA   +1.831.656.2149
X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman

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