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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">John,<br>
      <br>
      In Maya and Blender extrusions are used all of the time in
      modeling. Once the extrusion is created, it is immediately
      converted to a quad mesh. Animations are done on the quad mesh.
      The quad mesh is what is saved and exported.<br>
      <br>
      Leonard Daly<br>
      <br>
      <br>
      <br>
      <br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:1F6A6501-8C7E-4F6C-8007-BD0437284EA2@gmail.com"
      type="cite">
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      Maybe just show an example of an IndexedFaceSet which is an
      extrusion of a circle with 3 spline points, with the “bend”
      animated from 90 to 180 degrees.
      <div class=""><br class="">
        <div class="">It’s okay to use Blender or Maya, I’d just like to
          see what the results look like.</div>
        <div class=""><br class="">
        </div>
        <div class="">John</div>
        <div class="">
          <div>
            <blockquote type="cite" class="">
              <div class="">On Jan 26, 2016, at 8:01 PM, John Carlson
                <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:yottzumm@gmail.com" class="">yottzumm@gmail.com</a>>
                wrote:</div>
              <br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
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                <div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode:
                  space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;"
                  class="">So how do you propose to animate
                  IndexedFaceSets in a declarative or VRMLscript or
                  JavaScript manner if they are Extrusions?  Can we see
                  an example?  If the developer has to do it, can we
                  help them?
                  <div class=""><br class="">
                  </div>
                  <div class="">John<br class="">
                    <div class="">
                      <blockquote type="cite" class="">
                        <div class="">On Jan 26, 2016, at 6:58 PM,
                          Leonard Daly <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:Leonard.Daly@realism.com"
                            class="">Leonard.Daly@realism.com</a>>
                          wrote:</div>
                        <br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
                        <div class="">
                          <div class="moz-cite-prefix"
                            style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
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                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">On
                            1/26/2016 3:21 PM, John Carlson wrote:<br
                              class="">
                          </div>
                          <blockquote
                            cite="mid:DB8D08AE-E79F-4AF0-9F94-1E3A31C9153E@gmail.com"
                            type="cite" style="font-family: Helvetica;
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                            class="">Leonard, I think you forget that
                            Extrusion splines etc. can be animated.  If
                            Maya can export an Extrusion animation to
                            X3D V4.0 and your new elements can handle
                            animation of it, I think we are fine.</blockquote>
                          <br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
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                            class="">
                          <span style="font-family: Helvetica;
                            font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
                            font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;
                            letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto;
                            text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                            text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
                            widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); float:
                            none; display: inline !important;" class="">In
                            Maya and Blender, extrusions are converted
                            to IndexedFaceSets. These can be animated
                            through the usual mechanisms in those
                            applications. The results are typically
                            stored in a FBX file. Unfortunately, the FBX
                            format is not open and not too conducive to
                            importing in a browser. Autodesk provides a
                            C++ and Python API for accessing the file.</span><br
                            style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
                            12px; font-style: normal; font-variant:
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                            class="">
                          <br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
                            12px; font-style: normal; font-variant:
                            normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing:
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                            class="">
                          <span style="font-family: Helvetica;
                            font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
                            font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;
                            letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto;
                            text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                            text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
                            widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); float:
                            none; display: inline !important;" class="">Extrusions
                            are just a convenience node for creating a
                            constrained IndexedFaceSet. I am working on
                            exactly how X3D fits in the process chain
                            from modeling tools to display. The goal is
                            that X3D is an declarative archivable format
                            that has a browser-based run time. The goal
                            is to not reduce the display capability of
                            X3D in that chain; however, not all of the
                            functionality of X3D V3.3 is necessary to
                            remain in the node definitions to make that
                            happen.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><br
                            style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
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                            class="">
                          <br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
                            12px; font-style: normal; font-variant:
                            normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing:
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                            class="">
                          <span style="font-family: Helvetica;
                            font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
                            font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;
                            letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto;
                            text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                            text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
                            widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); float:
                            none; display: inline !important;" class="">Animation
                            of the spline and cross-sections of an
                            extrusion is much easier for the developer,
                            but puts a much greater load on the run-time
                            as it needs to re-triangulate the result on
                            each animation.</span><br
                            style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
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                            class="">
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                          <br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
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                            class="">
                          <span style="font-family: Helvetica;
                            font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
                            font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;
                            letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto;
                            text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                            text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
                            widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); float:
                            none; display: inline !important;" class="">Leonard
                            Daly</span><br style="font-family:
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                            class="">
                          <br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
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                            class="">
                          <blockquote
                            cite="mid:DB8D08AE-E79F-4AF0-9F94-1E3A31C9153E@gmail.com"
                            type="cite" style="font-family: Helvetica;
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                            class="">
                            <div class=""><br class="">
                            </div>
                            <div class="">John<br class="">
                              <div class="">
                                <blockquote type="cite" class="">
                                  <div class="">On Jan 26, 2016, at 1:47
                                    PM, Leonard Daly <<a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
                                      href="mailto:Leonard.Daly@realism.com"><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Leonard.Daly@realism.com">Leonard.Daly@realism.com</a></a>>
                                    wrote:</div>
                                  <br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
                                  <div class="">
                                    <div class="moz-cite-prefix"
                                      style="font-family: Helvetica;
                                      font-size: 12px; font-style:
                                      normal; font-variant: normal;
                                      font-weight: normal;
                                      letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
                                      auto; text-align: start;
                                      text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
                                      none; white-space: normal; widows:
                                      auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                                      -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                                      background-color: rgb(255, 255,
                                      255);">I would like to ask the
                                      question very differently. My
                                      question is not to ignore the
                                      importance of getting the
                                      definition correct for X3D <=
                                      V3.3.<br class="">
                                      <br class="">
                                      <br class="">
                                      Most (>95%) 3D modeling is done
                                      with a tool. In non-CAD
                                      environment, the tools is almost
                                      certainly Maya or Blender. Both of
                                      those tools have extrusions built
                                      in to their interface. I imagine
                                      CAD tools are similar. With so
                                      many tools providing graphical
                                      extrusion editors, and some of the
                                      tools being open-source (at least
                                      Blender);<br class="">
                                      <br class="">
                                      Do we need an extrusion node in V4
                                      to support content developed for
                                      V4+?<span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br
                                        class="">
                                      <br class="">
                                      <br class="">
                                      Leonard Daly<br class="">
                                      <br class="">
                                      <br class="">
                                      <br class="">
                                      On 1/26/2016 7:15 AM, Alekseyev,
                                      Vsevolod (NIH/NIAID) [E] wrote:<br
                                        class="">
                                    </div>
                                    <blockquote
                                      cite="mid:CC1C444FB9E32940BA18B288E9CAB83C213F30FC@msgb05.nih.gov"
                                      type="cite" class=""
                                      style="font-family: Helvetica;
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                                      normal; font-variant: normal;
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                                      auto; word-spacing: 0px;
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                                      background-color: rgb(255, 255,
                                      255);">
                                      <div class="" style="direction:
                                        ltr; font-family: Tahoma;
                                        font-size: 10pt;">Hi X3D
                                        community,
                                        <div class=""><br class="">
                                        </div>
                                        <div class="">I've tried and
                                          failed twice to explain the
                                          problems with the definition
                                          of the Extrusion node. So
                                          here's a tl;dr version:</div>
                                        <div class=""><br class="">
                                        </div>
                                        <div class="">Dear authors of
                                          the X3D standard, please take
                                          a careful look at the standard
                                          and answer me:</div>
                                        <div class=""><br class="">
                                        </div>
                                        <div class="">1) When the spine
                                          goes (0,0,0)-(0,-1,0), what is
                                          the CSP?</div>
                                        <div class="">Note: all answers
                                          but one will render one of the
                                          reference models in the Savage
                                          archive invalid.</div>
                                        <div class=""><br class="">
                                        </div>
                                        <div class="">2) When the spine
                                          goes <span class=""
                                            style="font-size:
                                            13.3333px;">(0,0,0)-(0,1,0)-(0,0,0),
                                            what is the CSP?</span></div>
                                        <div class=""><span class=""
                                            style="font-size:
                                            13.3333px;"><br class="">
                                          </span></div>
                                        <div class=""><span class=""
                                            style="font-size:
                                            13.3333px;">3) When the
                                            spine goes (0,0,0)-(1,1,0)-</span><span
                                            class="" style="font-size:
                                            13.3333px;">(1,1,0)-</span><span
                                            class="" style="font-size:
                                            13.3333px;">(1,1,0)-(2,0,0),
                                            what is the CSP for the
                                            three middle points?</span></div>
                                      </div>
                                      <br class="">
                                      <fieldset
                                        class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
                                      <br class="">
                                      <pre class="" wrap="">_______________________________________________
x3d-public mailing list
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org">x3d-public@web3d.org</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org">http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org</a>
</pre>
                                    </blockquote>
                                    <br class="" style="font-family:
                                      Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
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                                    <br class="" style="font-family:
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                                      font-style: normal; font-variant:
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                                    <div class="moz-signature"
                                      style="font-family: Helvetica;
                                      font-size: 12px; font-style:
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                                      font-weight: normal;
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                                      text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
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                                      auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                                      -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                                      background-color: rgb(255, 255,
                                      255);">--<span
                                        class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br
                                        class="">
                                      <font
                                        class="tahoma,arial,helvetica
                                        san serif" color="#333366"><font
                                          class="" size="+1"><b class="">Leonard
                                            Daly</b></font><br class="">
                                        3D Systems & Cloud
                                        Consultant<br class="">
                                        X3D Co-Chair on Sabbatical<br
                                          class="">
                                        LA ACM SIGGRAPH Chair<br
                                          class="">
                                        President, Daly Realism -<span
                                          class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i
                                          class="">Creating the Future</i></font></div>
                                    <span class="" style="font-family:
                                      Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
                                      font-style: normal; font-variant:
                                      normal; font-weight: normal;
                                      letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
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                                      none; white-space: normal; widows:
                                      auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                                      -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                                      background-color: rgb(255, 255,
                                      255); float: none; display: inline
                                      !important;">_______________________________________________</span><br
                                      class="" style="font-family:
                                      Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
                                      font-style: normal; font-variant:
                                      normal; font-weight: normal;
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                                      -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                                      background-color: rgb(255, 255,
                                      255);">
                                    <span class="" style="font-family:
                                      Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
                                      font-style: normal; font-variant:
                                      normal; font-weight: normal;
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                                      auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                                      -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                                      background-color: rgb(255, 255,
                                      255); float: none; display: inline
                                      !important;">x3d-public mailing
                                      list</span><br class=""
                                      style="font-family: Helvetica;
                                      font-size: 12px; font-style:
                                      normal; font-variant: normal;
                                      font-weight: normal;
                                      letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
                                      auto; text-align: start;
                                      text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
                                      none; white-space: normal; widows:
                                      auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                                      -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                                      background-color: rgb(255, 255,
                                      255);">
                                    <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org"
                                      class="" style="font-family:
                                      Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
                                      font-style: normal; font-variant:
                                      normal; font-weight: normal;
                                      letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
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                                      auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                                      -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                                      background-color: rgb(255, 255,
                                      255);">x3d-public@web3d.org</a><br
                                      class="" style="font-family:
                                      Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
                                      font-style: normal; font-variant:
                                      normal; font-weight: normal;
                                      letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
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                                      text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
                                      none; white-space: normal; widows:
                                      auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                                      -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                                      background-color: rgb(255, 255,
                                      255);">
                                    <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org"
                                      class="" style="font-family:
                                      Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
                                      font-style: normal; font-variant:
                                      normal; font-weight: normal;
                                      letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
                                      auto; text-align: start;
                                      text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
                                      none; white-space: normal; widows:
                                      auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                                      -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                                      background-color: rgb(255, 255,
                                      255);">http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org</a><br
                                      class="" style="font-family:
                                      Helvetica; font-size: 12px;
                                      font-style: normal; font-variant:
                                      normal; font-weight: normal;
                                      letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
                                      auto; text-align: start;
                                      text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
                                      none; white-space: normal; widows:
                                      auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                                      -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                                      background-color: rgb(255, 255,
                                      255);">
                                  </div>
                                </blockquote>
                              </div>
                              <br class="">
                            </div>
                            <br class="">
                            <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
                            <br class="">
                            <pre class="" wrap="">_______________________________________________
x3d-public mailing list
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org">x3d-public@web3d.org</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org">http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org</a>
</pre>
                          </blockquote>
                          <br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
                            12px; font-style: normal; font-variant:
                            normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing:
                            normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
                            text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
                            white-space: normal; widows: auto;
                            word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"
                            class="">
                          <br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
                            12px; font-style: normal; font-variant:
                            normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing:
                            normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
                            text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
                            white-space: normal; widows: auto;
                            word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"
                            class="">
                          <div class="moz-signature" style="font-family:
                            Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style:
                            normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight:
                            normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
                            auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                            text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
                            widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">--<span
                              class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br
                              class="">
                            <font class="tahoma,arial,helvetica san
                              serif" color="#333366"><font class=""
                                size="+1"><b class="">Leonard Daly</b></font><br
                                class="">
                              3D Systems & Cloud Consultant<br
                                class="">
                              X3D Co-Chair on Sabbatical<br class="">
                              LA ACM SIGGRAPH Chair<br class="">
                              President, Daly Realism -<span
                                class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i
                                class="">Creating the Future</i></font></div>
                          <span style="font-family: Helvetica;
                            font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
                            font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;
                            letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto;
                            text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                            text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
                            widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); float:
                            none; display: inline !important;" class="">_______________________________________________</span><br
                            style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
                            12px; font-style: normal; font-variant:
                            normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing:
                            normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
                            text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
                            white-space: normal; widows: auto;
                            word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"
                            class="">
                          <span style="font-family: Helvetica;
                            font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
                            font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;
                            letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto;
                            text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                            text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
                            widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); float:
                            none; display: inline !important;" class="">x3d-public
                            mailing list</span><br style="font-family:
                            Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style:
                            normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight:
                            normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans:
                            auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                            text-transform: none; white-space: normal;
                            widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"
                            class="">
                          <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org"
                            style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
                            12px; font-style: normal; font-variant:
                            normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing:
                            normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
                            text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
                            white-space: normal; widows: auto;
                            word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"
                            class="">x3d-public@web3d.org</a><br
                            style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
                            12px; font-style: normal; font-variant:
                            normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing:
                            normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
                            text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
                            white-space: normal; widows: auto;
                            word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"
                            class="">
                          <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org"
                            style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
                            12px; font-style: normal; font-variant:
                            normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing:
                            normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
                            text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
                            white-space: normal; widows: auto;
                            word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"
                            class="">http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org</a><br
                            style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size:
                            12px; font-style: normal; font-variant:
                            normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing:
                            normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start;
                            text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
                            white-space: normal; widows: auto;
                            word-spacing: 0px;
                            -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"
                            class="">
                        </div>
                      </blockquote>
                    </div>
                    <br class="">
                  </div>
                </div>
              </div>
            </blockquote>
          </div>
          <br class="">
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-signature">-- <br>
      <font class="tahoma,arial,helvetica san serif" color="#333366">
        <font size="+1"><b>Leonard Daly</b></font><br>
        3D Systems & Cloud Consultant<br>
        X3D Co-Chair on Sabbatical<br>
        LA ACM SIGGRAPH Chair<br>
        President, Daly Realism - <i>Creating the Future</i>
      </font></div>
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