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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 5/13/2018 4:12 PM, John Carlson
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAGC3UE=N9FfBEZAs0kbTQxZSRustkvw-jVdu5yF+6=Km3z+ekg@mail.gmail.com">
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<br>
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<div dir="ltr">On Sun, May 13, 2018, 7:00 PM Leonard Daly
<<a href="mailto:Leonard.Daly@realism.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">Leonard.Daly@realism.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
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<div class="m_-8175868158884289626moz-cite-prefix">On
5/13/2018 9:58 AM, John Carlson wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div class="m_-8175868158884289626WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal">You may want to resubmit your
3TM and Planet changes to Mantis. I searched for
3TM and Planet in Mantis (All Projects) and got
nothing significant back.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">However, I was denied access
to:</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="http://www.web3d.org/node/1694/submission/1671"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.web3d.org/node/1694/submission/1671</a></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
This is the Web3D Specification comment form. 1671 is
the submission ID. Only a few people (Anita, myself)
have access to the spec comment submissions. All
submissions are emailed to the X3D WG list and appear
there.<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">I didn't expect to gain access. Is there an
archive of the X3D wg list if I deleted my email?</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
You can get to the X3D WG archive list using <br>
1) <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.web3d.org/mailman/private/x3d_web3d.org/">http://www.web3d.org/mailman/private/x3d_web3d.org/</a> (Members
-> Resources -> Mailing Lists)<br>
2) the link from the listinfo page listed at the end each mailing
list message,<br>
3) the link at <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.web3d.org/member/member-only-mailing-lists">http://www.web3d.org/member/member-only-mailing-lists</a>
(member-only page. <br>
<br>
All of these methods will require you to log in using your Mantis
password (distributed every month, or on demand). This is a mailman
maintained archive with all of the features enabled. Note that there
is no list search capability. This is true for all member-only
lists. Public lists can be searched using Google or other search
engine.<br>
<br>
Leonard Daly<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAGC3UE=N9FfBEZAs0kbTQxZSRustkvw-jVdu5yF+6=Km3z+ekg@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="auto">
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<div class="m_-8175868158884289626WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Why?</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">and there’s:</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=1215"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=1215</a></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
For reference this issue is titled as "25.2.3 Specifying
a spatial reference frame - Inaccurate UTM example" and
is listed as public.<br>
</div>
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</div>
</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">Yes, seems unrelated. I might have seen Doug's
previous post to the mailing list, but I'm not sure. Nothing
came through email recently if he resubmitted it.</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">John</div>
<div dir="auto">
<div class="gmail_quote">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
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<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><br>
<br>
Leonard Daly<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div class="m_-8175868158884289626WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Not that I want to imagine
writing schema for such a thing…that’s why I hope
to get geoSystem into more reasonable shape in the
Unified Object Model (we need volunteers, I think)
before trying to do it in schema.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">John</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Sent from <a
href="https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">Mail</a> for Windows 10</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="border:none;padding:0in"><b>From: </b><a
href="mailto:gpugroup@gmail.com"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">GPU Group</a><br>
<b>Sent: </b>Sunday, May 13, 2018 9:16 AM<br>
<b>To: </b><a
href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">X3D Graphics public
mailing list</a><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [x3d-public] Invalid
geoSystem values in X3D Resources
BasicGeospatial examples.</p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I think N should be OK, just
as you say a redundant default.. I proposed
several new things in the geoSystem field,
submitted to spec comments a few months ago, so
I hope your processor works on the new things if
ever adopted.</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">-Doug</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">R,A,B,F,IF - ways to
drectly specifiy the shape of the ellipsoid so
other planet shapes and sizes could be modeled</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">3TM - similar to UTM
(except 3degree zones, no false northing or
easting, different central meridian scale
factor .9999)</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">...</p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I also proposed a Planet
node - allows multiple planets in one scene</p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Sun, May 13, 2018 at
6:14 AM, John Carlson <<a
href="mailto:yottzumm@gmail.com"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">yottzumm@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:</p>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid
#cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">The object model is
expressive enough to list conforming
values, yet accept others, but as far as I
know (I may be wrong here), it is not
expressive enough to express supported
geoSystem values. This is a problem.
How do we resolve it, and should we, if
we are accepting other values? Is it
resolved in X3DJSAIL? Should I get rid of
Roy's JSON subschema for geoSystem?<span
class="m_-8175868158884289626hoenzb"><span
style="color:#888888"></span></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:#888888">John</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Sun, May 13,
2018, 7:43 AM John Carlson <<a
href="mailto:yottzumm@gmail.com"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">yottzumm@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="border:none;border-left:solid
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I believe the
purpose of schema is to support
minimally acceptable files. It
should flag files which are
questionable. If a file can be
brought into conformance easily,
shouldn't it be?</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Yes, you
should be able to ignore the
results of the schema
validation...at your own risk.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">What is the
purpose of the X3D resources
examples, but to show a good
example practice? Or are we
testing tools to make sure
certain values are acceptable?
If that's the case, then the
schema should be updated for ALL
versions.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">John</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Sun, May
13, 2018, 7:31 AM John Carlson
<<a
href="mailto:yottzumm@gmail.com"
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">yottzumm@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="border:none;border-left:solid
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6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Then the
version of the document
should be upgraded to 4.0 or
above, and the corresponding
schema updated. I can
upgrade the schema for all
versions, since it is hard
coded into the schema
generator. But really we
need support from the object
model if possible. Right
now, I have to explicitly
allow it for all versions,
since I use stdin/stdout
instead of files. Does the
unified object model specify
a version # in its
contents? When the unified
object model supports "N" in
a usable fashion, then I can
code something into the
schema, or delete the
requirement to check
geoSystem.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks,
away from computer
presently, or I would check.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I don't
see why Roy went to all the
effort to create a schema,
if we are going to ignore
it?</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">This
applies in many areas...if
we merely have supported
values, yet others must be
accepted, why is there a
standard?</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I don't
believe it's ambiguous in
this case of X3D. A
missing "N" means Northern
Hemisphere.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">John</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On
Sun, May 13, 2018, 12:46
AM Andreas Plesch <<a
href="mailto:andreasplesch@gmail.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">andreasplesch@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="border:none;border-left:solid
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0in 0in
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="http://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19775-1/V3.2/Part01/components/geodata.html#Specifyingaspatialreference"
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.web3d.org/specifications/19775-1/V3.2/Part01/components/geodata.html#Specifyingaspatialreference</a></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">lists
the supported
strings for the
geoSystem MFString
field.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">The
prose choosing
'supported' over
'legal' or
'conforming' could
be taken to mean
that other than
listed strings may
be allowed to be
supported as well by
some browsers.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">However,
previous discussions
indicate that
schemas are not
sufficiently
expressive to
describe unknown but
conforming string
values.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">One
resolution was to
explicitly allow 'N'
in upcoming X3D
version, and perhaps
silently allow it
for 3.3.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Outside
of X3D UTM zones
often have the N
hemisphere
identifier to avoid
ambiguity.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Andreas</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="border:none;border-left:solid
#cccccc
1.0pt;padding:0in
0in 0in
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<p
class="MsoNormal">Date:
Sat, 12 May 2018
19:54:17 -0400<br>
From: John
Carlson <<a
href="mailto:yottzumm@gmail.com"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">yottzumm@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: Don Brutzman
<<a
href="mailto:brutzman@nps.edu"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">brutzman@nps.edu</a>>,
X3D Graphics
public mailing
list<br>
<<a
href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">x3d-public@web3d.org</a>><br>
Subject:
[x3d-public]
Invalid
geoSystem values
in X3D Resources
Basic<br>
Geospatial
examples.<br>
Message-ID: <<a
href="mailto:5af77ea8.1c69fb81.7da1f.13e3@mx.google.com" target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">5af77ea8.1c69fb81.7da1f.13e3@mx.google.com</a>><br>
Content-Type:
text/plain;
charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Don, These files
contain "N" in
geoSystem, which
I believe is not
valid, and
should be
removed (default
is Northern
Hemisphere, in
the standard, I
believe. "S" can
be specified?not
in this case).<br>
<br>
Is there a tool
which hasn?t
been changed
which is </p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br>
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href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org"
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moz-do-not-send="true">x3d-public@web3d.org</a><br>
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href="http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org"
target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org</a></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
x3d-public mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">x3d-public@web3d.org</a><br>
<a
href="http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org</a></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
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<br>
<pre>_______________________________________________
x3d-public mailing list
<a class="m_-8175868158884289626moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">x3d-public@web3d.org</a>
<a class="m_-8175868158884289626moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<p><br>
</p>
<div class="m_-8175868158884289626moz-signature">-- <br>
<font
class="m_-8175868158884289626tahoma,arial,helvetica
m_-8175868158884289626san
m_-8175868158884289626serif" color="#333366"> <font
size="+1"><b>Leonard Daly</b></font><br>
3D Systems & Cloud Consultant<br>
LA ACM SIGGRAPH Past Chair<br>
President, Daly Realism - <i>Creating the Future</i>
</font></div>
</div>
_______________________________________________<br>
x3d-public mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" target="_blank"
rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">x3d-public@web3d.org</a><br>
<a
href="http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org</a><br>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p><br>
</p>
<div class="moz-signature">-- <br>
<font class="tahoma,arial,helvetica san serif" color="#333366">
<font size="+1"><b>Leonard Daly</b></font><br>
3D Systems & Cloud Consultant<br>
LA ACM SIGGRAPH Past Chair<br>
President, Daly Realism - <i>Creating the Future</i>
</font></div>
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