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--></style></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink="#954F72"><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal>Thanks Joseph, I missed the exact wording. What I wanted to say was x3dom doesn’t support H-Anim 2 skinned deformation. I’m guessing however that one of BoxMan or Kicker is H-Anim 2.0. Can you clarify? In any case conversion to GPU is still required (for performance) it seems for H-Anim 2.0?<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>What tasks are left over?<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><ol style='margin-top:0in' start=1 type=1><li class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:0in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'>Conversion tests for JSON.<o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:0in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'>Schema tests for X3D JSON<o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:0in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'>Conversion to GPU (this is what I’m trying to get you guys to define more clearly).<o:p></o:p></li></ol><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Searching a bit more might reveal some source code we could use.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Thanks,<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>John<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Sent from <a href="https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986">Mail</a> for Windows 10</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div style='mso-element:para-border-div;border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal style='border:none;padding:0in'><b>From: </b><a href="mailto:andreasplesch@gmail.com">Andreas Plesch</a><br><b>Sent: </b>Thursday, November 29, 2018 8:34 AM<br><b>To: </b><a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org">X3D Graphics public mailing list</a><br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [x3d-public] HAnim and glTF skins</p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>My interest was in supporting animation in glTF inlines in x3dom. With basic animation pretty much solved as TimeSensor/Interpolator/Route combos, the next step is skinned animation. Since HAnim is actually not strictly limited to humanoids (if the H is ignored), it appears more and more feasible to use it to represent glTF skins and skeletons in a fairly complete manner. At least this is what my first manual translations suggest. I am not familiar with other skinned animation systems but most can export glTF.</p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Another feature in glTF are morph targets which are independent of skins. They are similar to HAnim displacers but I have not looked very closely if it is possible to define a mapping between them.</p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>One difference is that morph targets can be used outside of a joint hierarchy (skeleton) in glTF whereas displacers are confined to joints and segments within a x3d skeleton. Until displacers are released into the wild, it would mean that glTF meshes with morph targets have to be wrapped in a humanoid node. This seems possible. </p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Implementing HAnim vertex wise deformation ultimately needs to be in vertex shaders. This may actually mean using a glTF skin representation since it is perhaps more shader friendly.</p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>-Andreas</p></div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>---on the phone---</p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:4.8pt'><br>Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2018 16:35:17 -0800<br>From: Leonard Daly <<a href="mailto:Leonard.Daly@realism.com" target="_blank">Leonard.Daly@realism.com</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" target="_blank">x3d-public@web3d.org</a><br>Subject: Re: [x3d-public] HAnim and glTF skins<br>Message-ID: <<a href="mailto:20125083-023f-b96a-6586-ab8e6d3ea128@realism.com" target="_blank">20125083-023f-b96a-6586-ab8e6d3ea128@realism.com</a>><br>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"<br><br>Andreas,<br><br>I have read all of the messages with this subject. I am responding to <br>the first one because I think that is best where my question arises.<br><br>Are you working on an understanding and implementation of H-Anim skinned <br>animation in X3D or the more general animation of skinned surfaces that <br>is done in Maya/Blender/+ in most every other application/use?<br><br>If you are doing the more general case would it make more sense to get a <br>good understanding of the process and work-flow that is used in those <br>applications and practices?<br><br>If the intent is to use H-Anim with X3D, you will need to resolve the <br>differences between X3D V3.3/H-Anim V1.0 and X3D V4 (not yet in <br>existence)/H-Anim V2.0 (perhaps); as you have noted in one of the other <br>messages in this chain.<br><br><br>Leonard Daly<br><br><br>> I am collecting information on these skinning systems here:<br>><br>> <a href="https://github.com/andreasplesch/x3dom/wiki/HAnim-and-glTF-skins" target="_blank">https://github.com/andreasplesch/x3dom/wiki/HAnim-and-glTF-skins</a><br>><br>> [This is a editable wiki if anybody wants to add to it]<br>><br>> It looks like the less well known<br>><br>> jointBindingPositions/Rotations/Scales and skinBindingCoords/Normals<br>><br>> fields used for non-humanoid skeletons may be useful but I am not<br>> certain how to interprete those fields. Castle may not implement those<br>> as a search did not find a match ?<br>><br>> My understanding is that the transformation matrix defined by these<br>> fields needs to applied before joint trafos are applied. But to which<br>> vertices ? The ones listed in skinBindingCoords for sure (if they are<br>> indexed by skinIndex field in the joint) but how does<br>> skinBindingCoords and skinCoords field interact ? Does the<br>> skinBindingCoords field take precedence ? But why then have both<br>> fields in the first place ?<br>><br>> Could the jointBinding fields equivalently be replaced by a sub-Joint<br>> node under the joint the fields map to ?<br>><br>> Is there an example using these fields ?<br>><br>> Thanks,<br>><br>> -Andreas<br>><br>><br>><br>><br><br>-- <br>*Leonard Daly*<br>3D Systems & Cloud Consultant<br>LA ACM SIGGRAPH Past Chair<br>President, Daly Realism - /Creating the Future/<br>-------------- next part --------------<br>An HTML attachment was scrubbed...<br>URL: <<a href="http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/attachments/20181128/f49fe788/attachment-0001.html" target="_blank">http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/attachments/20181128/f49fe788/attachment-0001.html</a>><br><br>------------------------------<br><br><br>From: Leonard Daly<br>Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2018 4:35 PM<br>To: <a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" target="_blank">x3d-public@web3d.org</a><br>Subject: Re: [x3d-public] HAnim and glTF skins<br><br>Andreas,<br><br>I have read all of the messages with this subject. I am responding to the first one because I think that is best where my question arises.<br><br>Are you working on an understanding and implementation of H-Anim skinned animation in X3D or the more general animation of skinned surfaces that is done in Maya/Blender/+ in most every other application/use?<br><br>If you are doing the more general case would it make more sense to get a good understanding of the process and work-flow that is used in those applications and practices? <br><br>If the intent is to use H-Anim with X3D, you will need to resolve the differences between X3D V3.3/H-Anim V1.0 and X3D V4 (not yet in existence)/H-Anim V2.0 (perhaps); as you have noted in one of the other messages in this chain.<br><br><br>Leonard Daly<br><br>I am collecting information on these skinning systems here:<br><br><a href="https://github.com/andreasplesch/x3dom/wiki/HAnim-and-glTF-skins" target="_blank">https://github.com/andreasplesch/x3dom/wiki/HAnim-and-glTF-skins</a><br><br>[This is a editable wiki if anybody wants to add to it]<br><br>It looks like the less well known<br><br>jointBindingPositions/Rotations/Scales and skinBindingCoords/Normals<br><br>fields used for non-humanoid skeletons may be useful but I am not<br>certain how to interprete those fields. Castle may not implement those<br>as a search did not find a match ?<br><br>My understanding is that the transformation matrix defined by these<br>fields needs to applied before joint trafos are applied. But to which<br>vertices ? The ones listed in skinBindingCoords for sure (if they are<br>indexed by skinIndex field in the joint) but how does<br>skinBindingCoords and skinCoords field interact ? Does the<br>skinBindingCoords field take precedence ? But why then have both<br>fields in the first place ?<br><br>Could the jointBinding fields equivalently be replaced by a sub-Joint<br>node under the joint the fields map to ?<br><br>Is there an example using these fields ?<br><br>Thanks,<br><br>-Andreas<br><br><br><br><br><br>-- <br>Leonard Daly<br>3D Systems & Cloud Consultant<br>LA ACM SIGGRAPH Past Chair<br>President, Daly Realism - Creating the Future <br><br>-------------- next part --------------<br>An HTML attachment was scrubbed...<br>URL: <<a href="http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/attachments/20181128/d30e39f7/attachment.html" target="_blank">http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/attachments/20181128/d30e39f7/attachment.html</a>><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>Subject: Digest Footer<br><br>_______________________________________________<br>x3d-public mailing list<br><a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" target="_blank">x3d-public@web3d.org</a><br><a href="http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org" target="_blank">http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org</a><br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>End of x3d-public Digest, Vol 116, Issue 52<br>*******************************************</p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></body></html>