<html><head></head><body><div style="font-family: Verdana;font-size: 12.0px;"><div>Great, it's an unusual feeling not being alone :-)
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<div style="margin:0 0 10px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Sonntag, 31. März 2019 um 23:14 Uhr<br/>
<b>Von:</b> "John Carlson" <yottzumm@gmail.com><br/>
<b>An:</b> "Christoph Valentin" <christoph.valentin@gmx.at>, "X3D Graphics public mailing list" <x3d-public@web3d.org><br/>
<b>Cc:</b> "Sven-Erik Tiberg" <luletibbe@gmail.com><br/>
<b>Betreff:</b> RE: New X3D network working group suggestion: Standards forcollaboration I/O, processing and storage (SP-ARK)</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I will review you contributions now Christoph.</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">John</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Sent from <a href="https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986" target="_blank">Mail</a> for Windows 10</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="border: none;padding: 0.0in;"><b>From: </b><a href="mailto:christoph.valentin@gmx.at" onclick="parent.window.location.href='mailto:christoph.valentin@gmx.at'; return false;" target="_blank">Christoph Valentin</a><br/>
<b>Sent: </b>Sunday, March 31, 2019 2:47 PM<br/>
<b>To: </b><a href="mailto:yottzumm@gmail.com" onclick="parent.window.location.href='mailto:yottzumm@gmail.com'; return false;" target="_blank">John Carlson</a>; <a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" onclick="parent.window.location.href='mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org'; return false;" target="_blank">X3D Graphics public mailing list</a><br/>
<b>Cc: </b><a href="mailto:luletibbe@gmail.com" onclick="parent.window.location.href='mailto:luletibbe@gmail.com'; return false;" target="_blank">Sven-Erik Tiberg</a><br/>
<b>Subject: </b>Aw: New X3D network working group suggestion: Standards forcollaboration I/O, processing and storage (SP-ARK)</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">John,<br/>
<br/>
Of course I will add these ideas to the collection of inputs.<br/>
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>>>>>>>>What do you view as the primary SP-ARK actions?<br/>
<br/>
1) SP-ARK is dedicated to the use (and support) of X3Dv4<br/>
2) basically, the playground is open to anybody, who is interested in simple multiuser scenes<br/>
3) probably we will implement some demo application maybe even a server (depends on support)<br/>
4) Goal 1: help the Web3D Consortium in defining an application layer protocol for the Network Sensor<br/>
5) Goal 2: to be defined<br/>
6) Goal 3: to be defined<br/>
7) and so on<br/>
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8) SP-ARK has not been started yet, but with this e-mail the probability of a start increases :-)<br/>
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All the best<br/>
Christoph<br/>
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--<br/>
Diese Nachricht wurde von meinem Android Mobiltelefon mit GMX Mail gesendet.</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Am 31.03.19, 21:14, John Carlson <yottzumm@gmail.com> schrieb:</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Way up above the networksensor protocol is the concept of collaborate. How can we effectively store and communicate collaborations? Do they effectively store to a typical hierarchical file system, ala Git or Google Docs or do we need to create a new technology for collaborations? Might collaborations be “part of the network”? What if you couldn’t work without someone to collaborate with? Can a collaboration include parts of the physical world?</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Christoph, you can add this as a comment to SP-ARK. I think we need to develop some use cases or user stories for SP-ARK that involve collaboration if they are not already there:</p>
<p> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Primary actions are Create, Delete, Change, Inspect, Add, Remove, Move, Copy, Grant, Revoke. Record Date/Time for all actions performed.</p>
<p> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Create Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Create Object</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Create Subject</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Delete Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Delete Object</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Delete Subject</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Change Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Change Object</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Change Subject</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Inspect Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Inspect Object</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Inspect Subject</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Add Subject to Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Add Object to Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Add Collaboration to Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Remove Subject from Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Remove Object from Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Remove Collaboration from Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Move Subject to Location, Orientation in Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Move Object to Location, Orientation in Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Copy Object between Collaborations</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Copy Collaboration between Collaborations</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Move Collaboration to Location, Orientation in Collaboration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Grant access to “Collaboration, Object, Action” (key) to Subject</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Revoke access to “Collaboration, Object, Action” from Subject</p>
<p> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">So for pc.multiplayer, there are 3 collaborations, global tag, card game and chat, managed by a server.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Objects include location, card and message</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Subjects are clients</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">There is no real collaboration, except the server is effectively a collaboration. There is limited communication between servers.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">No grant/revoke.</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">Collaboration might be thought of as a server, table, channel, room, or conversation all at once.</p>
<p> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">More? I believe if we implement this much for a network protocol for SP-ARK, we will have achieved quite a bit.</p>
<p> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">We should probably prototype with an easy to use protocol, that can be used from JavaScript, and “upgrade” to a more industrial protocol once we have the patterns down. That is, lower levels can be swapped out by vendors. Thus we need a “JPA-like (Hibernate)” level which unifies the persistence and communication. I am thinking some object attributes can be annotated as persistent and/or communicateable.</p>
<p> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">What do you view as the primary SP-ARK actions?</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left: 4.8pt;">John</p>
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