<div dir="auto">Oops, I meant that X_ITE can be upgraded *without* breaking changes.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">John</div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Jan 15, 2021 at 12:58 PM John Carlson <<a href="mailto:yottzumm@gmail.com">yottzumm@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204)"><div dir="auto">Of note, JSON SAI needs to be unified between X3DJSAIL, X3DOM and X_ITE. Also, consider X3DJSONLD.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">This is the createX3DFromString or things like it. I suggest following X3DOM’s lead as defined by Andreas. I think that X_ITE can upgrade with breaking changes.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">John </div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Jan 15, 2021 at 9:20 AM Don Brutzman <<a href="mailto:brutzman@nps.edu" target="_blank">brutzman@nps.edu</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204)">Attendance is welcome<br>
<br>
X3D Weekly Meeting, 09-1000 Pacific time, Friday 15 JAN 2021.<br>
<br>
This week we have a feedback and discussion session regarding multiple topics, agenda with preliminary draft minutes follows.<br>
<br>
[0.1] Web3D Teleconference Information<br>
<a href="https://www.web3d.org/member/teleconference-information" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/member/teleconference-information</a><br>
<br>
> Please use the following link for all Web3D Consortium Meetings.<br>
><br>
> Join URL: <a href="https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81634670698?pwd=a1VPeU5tN01rc21Oa3hScUlHK0Rxdz09" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://us02web.zoom.us/j/81634670698?pwd=a1VPeU5tN01rc21Oa3hScUlHK0Rxdz09</a><br>
Confirmed that no Web3D Consortium member-only information is in these minutes.<br>
<br>
Lots of good activity is occurring. Recent minutes:<br>
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[0.2] [x3d-public] X3D minutes 8 JAN 2021: ballot in progress, 2021 specification planning<br>
<a href="https://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2021-January/014425.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2021-January/014425.html</a><br>
<br>
Points continued in today's meeting.<br>
<br>
[0.3] [x3d-public] X3D Semantic Web minutes 12 JAN 2021: book, Daffodil, field synonyms, simple-type field default values<br>
<a href="https://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2021-January/014450.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2021-January/014450.html</a><br>
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Congratulations to Jakub Flotyński on his book publication! 8)<br>
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[0.4] [x3d-public] X3D4 Audio minutes 13 JAN 2021: outline for W3C Audio working group outreach<br>
<a href="https://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2021-January/014454.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2021-January/014454.html</a><br>
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Note summary outline, announcement forthcoming to W3C Audio Working Group.<br>
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[0.5] [x3d-public] X3D Specification Review minutes 14 JAN 2021: EnvironmentLight and Environment nodes, SAI 19775-2<br>
<a href="https://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2021-January/014455.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2021-January/014455.html</a><br>
<br>
Note Mantis issues that document current approach.<br>
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[0.6] Web3D User Experience (Web3DUX) working group<br>
<a href="https://www.web3d.org/working-groups/web3d-user-experience" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/working-groups/web3d-user-experience</a><br>
<br>
"The Web3DUX working group develops and demonstrates best practices for X3D support of rich user experiences using a variety of Web3D technologies and content-delivery platforms."<br>
<br>
Of broad interest: the Web3DUX Working Group meets every other week on Monday. Always an interesting discussion.<br>
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[0.7] Design Printing Scanning (DPS) Working Group<br>
<a href="https://www.web3d.org/working-groups/design-printing-and-scanning" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/working-groups/design-printing-and-scanning</a><br>
<br>
"The Design Printing and Scanning Working Group develops and demonstrates best practices for X3D support of Computer-Aided Design, 3D Printing, and 3D Scanning applications."<br>
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Meets every Thursday, Vince Marchetti chairs. Web3D member only with multiple liaisons to multiple standards organizations.<br>
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<br>
1. Ballot sent to Web3D members, all comments welcome<br>
<br>
> X3Dv4 Public Working Draft<br>
> <br>
> [1.0] X3Dv4 Public Working Draft<br>
> <a href="https://www.web3d.org/x3dv4-public-working-draft" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/x3dv4-public-working-draft</a><br>
<br>
=====================<br>
* On 16 December 2020, the Web3D Consortium released Working Draft Revision 3 for review and comments prior to ISO submission. This document is available for viewing at X3Dv4Draft/ballot. Consortium members are afforded the opportunity to formally submit comments on this document for consideration by the Board of Directors and the X3D Working Group.<br>
=====================<br>
<br>
Last call for comments prior to Board consideration: immediate.<br>
<br>
> Public version of X3D4 Architecture (working draft 3) includes all markup for additions/changes/deletions.<br>
> <br>
> [1.1] X3D4 Public Working Draft Specification third release<br>
> <a href="https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4Draft/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-WD3/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4Draft/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-WD3/</a><br>
> <br>
> Private member version is pristine, with editing markup automagically removed from the HTML pages using an XML-based publication stylesheet.<br>
> <br>
> These online documents will remain unchanged during the ballot period.<br>
> <br>
> Specification documents are maintained as part of our member-only github version control. Account permission requests are welcome.<br>
> <br>
> [2.2] Github version control: Web3DConsortium / X3D<br>
> <a href="https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D</a><br>
> <br>
> X3D Specification editors (Dick and yours truly) expect to steadily continue with issue resolution. As ever: technical-tradeoff discussions occur on x3d-public list, with summarized technical details collected in Mantis.<br>
> <br>
> [1.3] Web3D Consortium Mantis Issue Tracker<br>
> <a href="https://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/</a><br>
> <br>
> All specific ballot comments will be recorded and resolved (or marked as deferred) shortly after the 30-day ballot period closes.<br>
> <br>
> Decision point: if approved by Web3D Consortium Board of Directors in January 2020, following editors review and application of comments, the X3D4 Architecture Committee Draft (CD) will be submitted to ISO IEC/JTC 1/SC 24 for international review and disposition. <br>
> <br>
> Dick and I will use a new CSS style 'X3D4Resolution' to identify any post-ballot changes to X3D working draft. We also have a category to that effect in Mantis, so if appropriate we'll use it. There are maybe a few dozen that are close to finish and only need final refinements/review, there are others that get deferred to X3D 4.1.<br>
> <br>
> We have some feedback from Khronos already, perhaps more to follow during the ballot period.<br>
> <br>
> In general, post ballot and post decision by Web3D Board:<br>
> <br>
> a. All comments will be considered by working group and editors,<br>
> b. All dispositions and deferrals will be properly noted, in draft spec if appropriate and in Mantis.<br>
> <br>
> Upon submission of pristine corrected, that will reset what is our top version in github. That gives full history of progress (aiding implementers and authors) plus reset us for the New Year.<br>
<br>
---<br>
<br>
2. X3D Working Group Charter<br>
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All X3D working groups are performing annual review of charter. Please see recent message by Anita Havele, Web3D Consortium Executive Director.<br>
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[2.0] Web3D Consortium Working Groups<br>
<a href="https://www.web3d.org/working-groups" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/working-groups</a><br>
<br>
"The Extensible 3D (X3D) Working Group coordinates all technical development efforts. Working groups are essentially driven by the efforts of participants. They focus on issues and technologies that produce improvements to our open standards, always achieving results that are royalty free for any purpose. All efforts are geared towards improving a coordinated set of steadily evolving ISO standards including X3D Version 4."<br>
<br>
[2.1] X3D Graphics Working Group<br>
<a href="https://www.web3d.org/working-groups/x3d" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/working-groups/x3d</a><br>
<br>
"The X3D Graphics Working Group addresses all X3D specification issues and coordinates the technical development of future improvements."<br>
<br>
[2.2] X3D Working Group Charter<br>
<a href="https://www.web3d.org/working-groups/x3d/charter" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/working-groups/x3d/charter</a><br>
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---<br>
<br>
3. Spec Editors Planning 2021<br>
<br>
Continuing scrutiny from last week, renumbered references:<br>
<br>
> [3.1] X3D Graphics Standards Relationships<br>
> <a href="https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dSpecificationRelationships.png" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3dSpecificationRelationships.png</a><br>
> <br>
> a. Primary next step: align ISO/IEC 19775-2 Scene Access Interface (SAI) with 19775-1 X3D4 Architecture.<br>
> <br>
> The SAI is the generic interface implemented by all of the corresponding programming languages.<br>
> <br>
> Mostly OK already. Will check for completeness, consistency, correctness.<br>
> <br>
> [3.2] X3D Abstract : Scene Access Interface (SAI) version 3.3<br>
> <a href="https://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19775-2/V3.3/index.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19775-2/V3.3/index.html</a><br>
> <br>
> Call for comment: what other SAI methods might be needed?<br>
> <br>
> - For example: exposure to view matrix, transformation matrix, utility methods in X3DOM/X_ITE, etc.<br>
<br>
More feedback requested. This will be an ongoing issue as we review all of the programming-language bindings.<br>
<br>
> Already noted: our legacy focus has (obviously) been on client side, it is interesting to note that server side (and cloud computing) can be considered from a compatibility perspective. Can we run SAI headless, hooked up to other things? This is not foreseen as any kind of significant design change, rather simply alignment of what we have already.<br>
<br>
Confirmed<br>
<br>
> b. Open issue: whether to include X3DUOM as an informative reference. More discussion to follow.<br>
> <br>
> [3.3] X3D Unified Object Model (X3DUOM)<br>
> <a href="https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3DUOM.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3DUOM.html</a><br>
<br>
Am thinking that this might best go in [3.2] X3D Abstract : Scene Access Interface (SAI) itself. Reactions welcome.<br>
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> c. Discussion of file encodings. Straightforward.<br>
> <br>
> d. Discussion of programming-language APIs.<br>
> <br>
> - 19775-3/4/5 for C, C++, C# binding. Document should be straightforward but getting additional champions(s) for implementations is a shared need. Alignment with major existing APIs (e.g. Unity3D) is especially valuable.<br>
> - 19775-6 noted maturity of implementation and multiple uses already, should be straightforward.<br>
> <br>
> Something to think about: sorting numerically in priority order ECMAScript, Java (as is), then python, C#, C++, C<br>
<br>
Absent objections, am ready to renumber the proposed programming-language bindings in order of specification maturity.<br>
<br>
---<br>
<br>
4. Chisel Codebase Again Available<br>
<br>
[4.0] X3D Resources, Conversions and Translation Tools: Chisel<br>
<a href="https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dResources.html#Chisel" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dResources.html#Chisel</a><br>
<br>
"15. Chisel VRML Optimisation Tool with autoinstaller and documentation provided by Halden Virtual Reality Centre. Originally built by Trapezium and maintained by NIST."<br>
<br>
Thanks to Michael Louka's careful stewardship over many years, am happy to report that this Java codebase - dating to the earliest days of VRML97 and the Web3D Consortium - is *again available and still runs*. Way cool.<br>
<br>
[4.1] Sourceforge, Web3D Consortium open source, X3D tools, Chisel<br>
<a href="https://sourceforge.net/p/x3d/code/HEAD/tree/www.web3d.org/x3d/tools/chisel" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://sourceforge.net/p/x3d/code/HEAD/tree/www.web3d.org/x3d/tools/chisel</a><br>
<a href="https://sourceforge.net/p/x3d/code/HEAD/tree/www.web3d.org/x3d/tools/chisel/test/HelloWorldScreenshotChisel.png" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://sourceforge.net/p/x3d/code/HEAD/tree/www.web3d.org/x3d/tools/chisel/test/HelloWorldScreenshotChisel.png</a><br>
<br>
Exciting development!<br>
<br>
---<br>
<br>
5. HTML X3D Guidelines feedback<br>
<br>
> Thanks to Andreas Plesch for great emails, we will consider his points next week.<br>
> <br>
> [5.1] [x3d-public] L.3.1 Re: Annex L HTML authoring guidelines for X3D4; naming Script versus X3DScript<br>
> <a href="http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2020-December/014276.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2020-December/014276.html</a><br>
> <br>
> [5.2] <a href="http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2020-December/014328.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2020-December/014328.html</a><br>
> <br>
> [5.3] <a href="http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2020-December/014327.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2020-December/014327.html</a><br>
> <br>
> [5.4] <a href="http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2021-January/014345.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2021-January/014345.html</a><br>
> <br>
> [5.5] <a href="http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2021-January/014352.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2021-January/014352.html</a><br>
> <br>
> Continued dialog on email list welcome. We will review next week, all comments and insight are welcome.<br>
<br>
Any feedback out there?<br>
<br>
---<br>
<br>
6. Join!<br>
<br>
There has been no better time to be a Web3D Consortium Member, much value continues to steadily emerge.<br>
<br>
[6.0] Join the Web3D Consortium<br>
<a href="https://www.web3d.org/join" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/join</a><br>
<br>
---<br>
<br>
Hoping everyone is personally "staying safe" as we progress into a new year.<br>
<br>
all the best, Don<br>
-- <br>
Don Brutzman Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br <a href="mailto:brutzman@nps.edu" target="_blank">brutzman@nps.edu</a><br>
Watkins 270, MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA +1.831.656.2149<br>
X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics <a href="http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman</a><br>
<br>
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</blockquote></div></div>
</blockquote></div></div>