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<p>We'll work on rearranging the folders after I get stuff checked
in.</p>
<p>John<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 8/27/21 8:50 AM, Myeong Won Lee
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAKt=rvYQRkWugzxV5syYEro8GHCRcqNKs0v7jwtuLQ1aKDzMZw@mail.gmail.com">
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">Dear John,<br>
<br>
Thank you for your efforts in setting up the GitHub
repository.<br>
<br>
In the folders, I think that the "CD" folders may not be
necessary because we have restarted with WDs and the CDs are
old versions of the WDs.<br>
I submitted the CDs last year, but they were not approved as
CD texts, and so I resubmitted them as WDs.<br>
We should work on the WD texts.<br>
How about deleting the CD folders?<br>
In addition, if WD-originals are old versions, it would be OK
to delete them.<br>
<br>
In summary, I think that the folders should be as follows:<br>
<br>
./ISO-IEC19777/ISO-IEC19777-3/ISO-IEC19777-3v3.3-WD<br>
./ISO-IEC19777/ISO-IEC19777-4/ISO-IEC19777-4v3.3-WD<br>
./ISO-IEC19777/ISO-IEC19777-5/ISO-IEC19777-5v3.3-WD<br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
</div>
<div>Sincerely,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Myeong</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Aug 27, 2021 at 6:30
AM John Carlson <<a href="mailto:yottzumm@gmail.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">yottzumm@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<p>Myeong,</p>
<p>Thanks for your efforts on the C/C#/C++ standards!</p>
<p>My understanding from Don is that we want the current
WD versions of the 19777-3, 19777-4 and 19777-5
standards checked into GitHub, somewhere below this
folder: <a
href="https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://github.com/Web3DConsortium/X3D</a>
(If you need assistance, let me know, it's quite
confusing. We'll probably have to do things like rename
the folders once unpacked from the zips and move them
from). Issues with the standards should go into Mantis.
Google Drive/Docs, while important for private sharing,
are not suitable for group editing of standards.
GitHub has adequate protections in the X3D repository.
With your permission, I will check your Google shared
zips into GitHub unpacked. Probably in the folders here
that you identify:</p>
<p>./ISO-IEC19777/ISO-IEC19777-4/ISO-IEC19777-4v3.3/ISO-IEC19777-4v3.3-WD<br>
./ISO-IEC19777/ISO-IEC19777-4/ISO-IEC19777-4v3.3/ISO-IEC19777-4v3.3-CD<br>
./ISO-IEC19777/ISO-IEC19777-3/ISO-IEC19777-3v3.3/ISO-IEC19777-3v3.3-CD<br>
./ISO-IEC19777/ISO-IEC19777-3/ISO-IEC19777-3v3.3/ISO-IEC19777-3v3.3-WD<br>
./ISO-IEC19777/ISO-IEC19777-5/ISO-IEC19777-5v3.3/ISO-IEC19777-5v3.3-CD<br>
./ISO-IEC19777/ISO-IEC19777-5/ISO-IEC19777-5v3.3/ISO-IEC19777-5v3.3-WD</p>
<p>( Please confirm that the WD folders are correct).</p>
<p>These are the original folders that where already there
that are moved out of the way.<br>
</p>
<p>./ISO-IEC19777-4/ISO-IEC19777-4v3.3/ISO-IEC19777-4v3.3-WD-original<br>
./ISO-IEC19777-3/ISO-IEC19777-3v3.3/ISO-IEC19777-3v3.3-WD-original<br>
./ISO-IEC19777-5/ISO-IEC19777-5v3.3/ISO-IEC19777-5v3.3-WD-original</p>
<p>I currently all these changes ready for a git add,
commit, push. I have done 1) ready and a little bit of
aiming. I need approval to fire.</p>
<p>I will enter a Mantis ticket for these changes.<br>
</p>
<p>===========================================================<br>
</p>
<p>Secondly, according to Don, we need to move discussions
to the x3d-public mailing list. If issues are
sensitive, then there's the x3d mailing list. Here's
how to subscribe to x3d-public: <a
href="http://www.web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org</a><br>
</p>
<p>Issues with source code artifacts should be can be
recorded here: <a
href="https://sourceforge.net/p/x3d/discussion/"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://sourceforge.net/p/x3d/discussion/</a></p>
<p>Source code artifacts should go here in addition:
<a
href="https://sourceforge.net/p/x3d/code/HEAD/tree/www.web3d.org/x3d/languages/"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://sourceforge.net/p/x3d/code/HEAD/tree/www.web3d.org/x3d/languages/</a>
I can facilitate uploads to there. Myeong, with your
permission, I will archive the old code (many months
old) to "legacy" under the main x3d-code folder.</p>
<p>If you have any open questions, please post to the
x3d-public list (respond to this email).</p>
<p>I don't believe source code changes require Mantis.<br>
</p>
<p>John<br>
</p>
<div>On 8/26/21 9:34 AM, Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV)
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Again: it would be useful to have
to have a design page that discussed programming
patterns and open issues.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Again: GitHub is master version,
being aware that differences exist but are not
identified isn’t very useful.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Again: Hoping we can “get on the
good foot” in how this effort is pursued. This is
how the Java, JSON, Python and Turtle language
bindings built towards consensus and were all
successfully accomplished.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks for all efforts, hopefully
they can become productive and fruitful by working
deliberately together.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">all the best, Don<br>
<span style="font-family:"Courier New"">--
<br>
Don Brutzman Naval Postgraduate School, Code
USW/Br <a href="mailto:brutzman@nps.edu"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">brutzman@nps.edu</a><br>
Watkins 270, MOVES Institute, Monterey CA
93943-5000 USA +1.831.656.2149<br>
X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics <a
href="http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">
http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman</a></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div
style="border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-top:1pt
solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="border:none;padding:0in"><b>From:
</b><a href="mailto:yottzumm@gmail.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">John
Carlson</a><br>
<b>Sent: </b>Friday, August 20, 2021 12:36 PM<br>
<b>To: </b><a href="mailto:brutzman@nps.edu"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">Brutzman,
Donald (Don) (CIV)</a>; <a
href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">
x3d-public@web3d.org</a>; <a
href="mailto:myeongwonlee@gmail.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">Myeong
Won Lee</a>; <a
href="mailto:gpugroup@gmail.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">GPU Group</a><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [x3d-public] X3D meeting
minutes 20 AUG 2021, C C++ C# and Mantis
MetadataDate</p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div style="border:1pt solid
rgb(0,70,121);padding:2pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="line-height:12pt;background:rgb(0,70,121)"><span
style="font-size:10pt;color:yellow">NPS WARNING:
*external sender* verify before acting.</span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p>Don, Myeong, Doug,</p>
<p>I noticed that there are no virtual methods in
the C++ spec SAI I got (examples, yes, except for
~SAIExample5()) on <a
href="http://drive.google.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">drive.google.com</a>. I
do not think they are necessary, but may be useful
when defining subclasses for people who want to
subclass from the SAI abstract and concrete
nodes. <a
href="https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.geeksforgeeks.org%2Fvirtual-function-cpp%2F&data=04%7C01%7Cbrutzman%40nps.edu%7C4e6ee194cc544357635908d964118d12%7C6d936231a51740ea9199f7578963378e%7C0%7C0%7C637650850010851004%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=EkRmxJLy9eZ1jjBqCZ%2FS99OiG9B9NcBGWff6ixidzNA%3D&reserved=0"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">
https://www.geeksforgeeks.org/virtual-function-cpp/</a>
Note that most methods are virtual in Java,
without the keyword. I think virtual methods are
slower than regular methods, last I heard. But
I'm pretty sure all destructors should be
virtual? I've forgotten. Some discussion whether
destructors should be present in the spec is
welcome. The virtual destructor ensures that the
superclass destructor is not called.</p>
<p>I think it would be useful to have Doug Sanden
review the abstract and concrete class and structs
before making big decisions.</p>
<p>I am also unsure why the first parameter to many
C function pointer declarations is void* instead
of passing a pointer to a struct type?</p>
<p>In all cases, C/C++/C# it might be useful for
setter functions and members to return this or
*this, instead of void. We need set functions to
return this for creating builders I'm fairly sure.
(In C SAI, the first parameter is called this,
it's not a keyword that I know of).</p>
<p>I'm glad I am reviewing this! We'll see if
anything else pops into my head after I send the
message!</p>
<p>Thanks,</p>
<p>John</p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 8/20/21 1:46 PM, Brutzman,
Donald (Don) (CIV) wrote:</p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<p class="MsoNormal">Attendees John Carlson, Vince
Marchetti, Dick Puk, Don Brutzman</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="margin-left:0.25in"> <span>1.<span
style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span>Very useful discussion today, we
reviewed proposed language bindings</p>
<ol style="margin-top:0in" type="1" start="1">
<li style="margin-left:0in">19755- 3, C</li>
<li style="margin-left:0in">19755- 4, C++</li>
<li style="margin-left:0in">19755- 5, C#</li>
</ol>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">We discussed whether special
treatment is deserved for exposing these draft
specifications. 22 Web3D members have access to
them now.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Language bindings need
compilable interfaces for ISO, and at least two
implementations for Web3D.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Close inspection of each
shows that a handful of example programs are
available for test development, and could be
used as basis for X3dToCCppCsharp.xslt
conversion stylesheet.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Close inspection of detailed
abstract interfaces, and detailed node/statement
implementations for libraries are available
(with some omissions). Each appears quite
similar to the others. Regeneration via X3DUOM
of compilable “header” or interface files
matching the source code in the HTML is
possible.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">C and C++ language
compilation is easily possible using gcc
compiler. Compilation of C# is not so clear,
some open-source implementations are available.
Once initial compilation of headers is
accomplished, further scrutiny and possible
evolution of design patterns would be
straightforward. We’ll use gcc on the next
round since it is part of our build
infrastructure already.</p>
<ol style="margin-top:0in" type="1" start="1">
<li style="margin-left:0in">GCC, the GNU
Compiler Collection <a
href="https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgcc.gnu.org%2F&data=04%7C01%7Cbrutzman%40nps.edu%7C4e6ee194cc544357635908d964118d12%7C6d936231a51740ea9199f7578963378e%7C0%7C0%7C637650850010860960%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=InQmxP%2BpSNqMvgzuLehZ1WsMAhVzTsElQ6bPWfUJeqw%3D&reserved=0"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">
https://gcc.gnu.org</a> </li>
<li style="margin-left:0in"><a
href="https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fstackoverflow.com%2Fquestions%2F26078437%2Fwhy-does-gcc-support-java-and-not-c-sharp&data=04%7C01%7Cbrutzman%40nps.edu%7C4e6ee194cc544357635908d964118d12%7C6d936231a51740ea9199f7578963378e%7C0%7C0%7C637650850010860960%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=ID4Gzh%2Bw9bW80EYdfPZCPLjH1m%2BlKDZnZGINmJjcyHA%3D&reserved=0"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://stackoverflow.com/questions/26078437/why-does-gcc-support-java-and-not-c-sharp</a>
</li>
</ol>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">We have enough that immediate
sharing of shared specifications can be deferred
until broader discussion is warranted. Sharing
of generated code will help, and that does not
have to be restricted.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">We are concerned about
personnel availability, but will keep working on
it step by step.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
We will welcome all help and participation as
the work proceeds.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="margin-left:0.25in"> <span>2.<span
style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span>Mantis issue progress is
persevering steadily each week.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="margin-left:0.75in"> <span>1.<span
style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span>Mantis 1218 for creating a
MetadataDate or MetadataTime node needs to be
deferred to X3D4.1. Meanwhile we might an
example scene demonstrating how to do such
representations with existing nodes, workably
across all forms of X3D. E.g. pseudocode
examples:</p>
<p style="margin-left:0.75in"><MetadataDouble
name=”time” value=“0.0”
reference=”Unix reference of time with start at
1 JAN 1970”/></p>
<p style="margin-left:0.75in"><MetadataString
name=”TuesdayLunch”
value=“24-AUG-2021-1200-pacific” reference=”XSD,
XML Schema Definition”/> <MetadataString
name=”ThankGoodnessItsMonday”
value=“23-AUG-2021-1200-pacific” reference=”ISO
8601 Time standard”/> </p>
<p style="margin-left:0.75in">Any scene of
examples would be fully detailed and
cross-referenced for clarity.</p>
<p style="margin-left:0.75in"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:black;background:rgb(243,243,243)">Mantis
1218: 07.2.4 MetadataDate - New node type, or
new data type</span></p>
<p style="margin-left:0.75in"><a
href="https://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=1218"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view.php?id=1218</a>
</p>
<p style="margin-left:0.75in"> </p>
<p style="margin-left:0.75in"> <span>2.<span
style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span>Other mantis issues are being
fixed and addresses each week. Membership has
value.</p>
<p style="margin-left:0.75in"><a
href="https://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view_all_bug_page.php"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.web3d.org/member-only/mantis/view_all_bug_page.php</a>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks everyone for a worthy
effort today. Have fun with X3D! 8)</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<div
style="border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-top:1pt
solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Brutzman,
Donald (Don) (CIV) <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, August 20, 2021 12:27
AM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a
href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:rgb(5,99,193)">x3d-public@web3d.org</span></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV) <a
href="mailto:brutzman@nps.edu"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:rgb(5,99,193)"><brutzman@nps.edu></span></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> X3D meeting agenda 20 AUG
2021, C C++ C# and Mantis</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Regular weekly call once
again this week, Friday 10-1100 Pacific on Web3D
conference line.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">We will review our approach
to C C++ C# encodings and also ongoing Mantis
progress. Additional topics welcome.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal">all the best, Don</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>-- </span> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Don Brutzman Naval
Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br <a
href="mailto:brutzman@nps.edu"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:rgb(5,99,193)">brutzman@nps.edu</span></a></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Watkins 270, MOVES
Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA
+1.831.656.2149</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>X3D graphics, virtual
worlds, navy robotics <a
href="http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:rgb(5,99,193)">http://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman</span></a></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
</p>
<pre>_______________________________________________</pre>
<pre>x3d-public mailing list</pre>
<pre><a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">x3d-public@web3d.org</a></pre>
</blockquote>
</div>
<pre style="margin-right:0.5in;margin-bottom:5pt;margin-left:0.5in"><a href="http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org</a></pre>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:"Courier
New""> </span></p>
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-- <br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:0.0001pt;line-height:12pt"><span
lang="EN-US"><font size="1" face="verdana,
sans-serif">Myeong Won Lee, PhD, Professor<br>
Faculty of Computer Science, U. of Suwon <br>
Hwaseong, Gyeonggi-do, 18323 Korea <br>
E-mail) <a
href="mailto:myeongwonlee@gmail.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">myeongwonlee@gmail.com</a>,
<a href="mailto:mwlee@suwon.ac.kr"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">mwlee@suwon.ac.kr</a></font><font
face="Cambria, serif"><span></span></font></span></p>
</div>
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