<div dir="ltr">url parameters seem interesting. If the x3d browser itself is doing the conversion --after loading the Inline raw file, then parsing and converting to x3d before signaling loaded=TRUE,<div>- servers seem to ignore unknown parameters</div><div>x loading local files > adding a ? parameter: FILE NOT FOUND</div><div>-Doug</div><div>a) web url loading</div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"><a href="https://andreasplesch.github.io/3d-tiles-examples/migration/output_from_1.0/Tilesets/TilesetOfTilesets/tileset.json" style="color:blue">https://andreasplesch.github.io/3d-tiles-examples/migration/output_from_1.0/Tilesets/TilesetOfTilesets/tileset.json</a>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"><a href="https://andreasplesch.github.io/3d-tiles-examples/migration/output_from_1.0/Tilesets/TilesetOfTilesets/tileset.json?note_to_loader=load_as_cesium" style="color:blue">https://andreasplesch.github.io/3d-tiles-examples/migration/output_from_1.0/Tilesets/TilesetOfTilesets/tileset.json?note_to_loader=load_as_cesium</a>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">both:</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">response MIME/Content Type=application/json; charset=utf-8 </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">loads json as text in browser window. Mimetype json not very helpful for determining web3d suitable content</p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"><br></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Youtube server also ignores unknown parameters</p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2mPS-2guHVo" style="color:blue">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2mPS-2guHVo</a>
</p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">
</p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2mPS-2guHVo¬e_to_loader=load_as_cesium" style="color:blue">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2mPS-2guHVo¬e_to_loader=load_as_cesium</a>
</p></div><div><br></div><div>b) local file loading </div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">C:\Users\dougs\Downloads\tileset.json </p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">- loads json as text in web browser window</p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"> <span style="font-size:10pt">C:\Users\dougs\Downloads\tileset.json?note_to_loader=load_as_cesium</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">X File not found</p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">The Inline would need to scrape its parameters out of the url before attempting to load.</p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm;font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif"><br></p></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote gmail_quote_container"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 25, 2026 at 1:03 PM Don Brutzman via x3d-public <<a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org">x3d-public@web3d.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div>Distilling these points, I added the following editors note to v4.1 draft InlineGeometry</div><div><ul style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"><li style="margin-top:4px"><span style="background-color:rgb(207,226,243)">Composition of online addresses and parameter values within a <i>url</i> field offers the possibility of invoking an online server to perform file-format conversions. See email thread <a href="https://web3d.org/pipermail/x3d-public_web3d.org/2026-March/022355.html" target="_blank">[x3d-public] Inline > type field > for loading / converting / parsing other content</a> for further discussion. Such additional functionality supports the use cases under consideration by Metaverse Standards Forum (MSF) <a href="https://metaverse-standards.org/domain-groups/3d-web-interoperability" target="_blank">3D Web Interoperability</a> Working Group.</span></li></ul></div><div><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)"><font face="monospace">all the best, Don</font></div><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)"><font face="monospace">-- </font></div><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)"><font face="monospace">X3D Graphics, Maritime Robotics, Distributed Simulation</font></div><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)"><font face="monospace">Relative Motion Consulting <a href="https://RelativeMotion.info" target="_blank">https://RelativeMotion.info</a></font></div></div></div></div><br></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 25, 2026 at 11:44 AM Don Brutzman <<a href="mailto:don.brutzman@gmail.com" target="_blank">don.brutzman@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div><div>Doug, thanks for scrutiny of InlineGeometry and your post.</div><div><ul><li><a href="https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4Draft/ISO-IEC19775-1v4.1-CD/Part01/components/networking.html#InlineGeometry" target="_blank">X3D Architecture 4.1 draft — ISO/IEC 19775-1:202x — 9 Networking component - 9.4.3 InlineGeometry</a></li><li><a href="https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4Draft/ISO-IEC19775-1v4.1-CD/Part01/components/networking.html#InlineGeometry" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4Draft/ISO-IEC19775-1v4.1-CD/Part01/components/networking.html#InlineGeometry</a></li></ul></div><div>Option 0: automatic detection? MIME type offers a lot (see below for more), then careful scrutiny is always warranted. A browser does not have to load something it is unable to handle (and indeed probably cannot do so anyway).</div><div><br></div><div>Option 1: new node type? If we find new functionality (or perhaps security precautions) in common between Inline and InlineGeometry that also pertains to other nodes having a url field, then it can be added to X3DUrlObject. Otherwise it is typically best over long term to keep it associated with node itself.</div><div><br></div><div>Option 2: additional fields to support conversions? I think we should be very reluctant to specify external functionality. However of note is that many online applications can be invoked by composing url values and parameters. Experimentation is certainly possible via the current InlineGeometry url. Here is an example composition:</div><div><ul><li><font face="arial, sans-serif"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0);text-align:-webkit-center">X3D Example Archives: Humanoid Animation, Bones, All Bones Collection, X_ITE (</span><a title="X_ITE Playground editor by Holger Seelig" href="https://create3000.github.io/x_ite/playground/?url=https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/HumanoidAnimation/Bones/AllBonesCollection.x3d" style="text-align:-webkit-center;background-color:rgb(207,226,243)" target="_blank">Playground</a><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0);text-align:-webkit-center">)</span></font></li><li><a href="https://create3000.github.io/x_ite/playground/?url=https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/HumanoidAnimation/Bones/AllBonesCollection.x3d" target="_blank">https://create3000.github.io/x_ite/playground/?url=https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/HumanoidAnimation/Bones/AllBonesCollection.x3d</a></li></ul><div>which is available at</div></div><div><ul><li><a href="https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/HumanoidAnimation/Bones/AllBonesCollectionIndex.html" target="_blank">https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/HumanoidAnimation/Bones/AllBonesCollectionIndex.html</a></li></ul></div><div>Given such possibilities, if experimentation showed some useful long-term patterns, then next step would be establishing recommended/best practices and showing interoperability before elevating such features into the spec. X3D is Extensible, after all.</div><div><br></div><div>John, to your points:</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">I think MIME/HTTP Content-Type headers may prove useful here.</blockquote><div dir="auto"><br></div><div>Yes, certainly, that information comes along with http/https requests exchanged with properly configured servers. Thus content type is available to browser, along with file extension. For local files (relative url addresses) such negotiation typically occurs with the local operating system.</div><div><br></div><div>I believe that such concepts are addressed by existing draft paragraph containing</div><div><ul><li><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;background-color:rgb(255,255,0)">"can be determined with some form of content negotiation (see </span><span title="IETF revision" style="background-color:yellow;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"><a href="https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4Draft/ISO-IEC19775-1v4.1-CD/Part01/references.html#RFC9110" target="_blank">RFC9110</a></span><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;background-color:rgb(255,255,0)">)"</span></li></ul></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Do we want to provide CDATA Sections or data URIs for non-X3D content?</blockquote><div><br></div><div>The purpose of the InlineGeometry node is to perform a file retrieval, so I am not seeing a use case... We don't do that for Inline either.</div></div><div><br></div><div>Again thanks everyone for considering the possibilities. Have fun with X3D InlineGeometry!</div><div><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)"><font face="monospace"><br></font></div><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)"><font face="monospace">all the best, Don</font></div><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)"><font face="monospace">-- </font></div><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)"><font face="monospace">X3D Graphics, Maritime Robotics, Distributed Simulation</font></div><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34)"><font face="monospace">Relative Motion Consulting <a href="https://RelativeMotion.info" target="_blank">https://RelativeMotion.info</a></font></div></div></div></div><br></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 25, 2026 at 10:26 AM John Carlson via x3d-public <<a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" target="_blank">x3d-public@web3d.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto">I think MIME/HTTP Content-Type headers may prove useful here.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Do we want to provide CDATA Sections or data URIs for non-X3D content?</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">John</div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 25, 2026 at 11:08 AM GPU Group via x3d-public <<a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" target="_blank">x3d-public@web3d.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">Inline > content type field > for loading / converting / parsing other content <div>other file formats - .obj, .ply, .json - may contain content suitable for converting into equivalent web3d nodes / scenegraphs. In theory this could be done while loading the content as an inline based on file suffix. But those generic file type suffixes don't say what type of nodes we are expecting to get / want to extract or convert to web3d nodes. </div><div>Option 0: Sniffing the file for automatic detection of suitable web3d node content</div><div>Option 1: A new node type, derived from Inline, for each combination of file suffix and desired content conversion - assumes main scene author with the Inline URL also knows the type of content / conversion</div><div>Option 2: an additional field on standard Inline, saying what content converter to use, an enum field with things like "SPLAT", "CESIUM" </div><div>Then the web3d browser developer would write code to process / convert the (file type, content converter type) cases to web3d nodes/scenegraph after Inline loads the file.</div><div><br></div><div>-Doug</div><div><br></div></div>
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