[x3d-public] An annotations example and project

[John Carlson]

The best i can suggest is look for a .glb reader/loader and replace the
backend with X3D.  Someone should speak up and offer an implementation of a
.glb reader.

John

On Sun, Oct 9, 2022 at 7:33 PM Joseph D Williams <joedwil at earthlink.net>
wrote:

>
>
>    - Stepping backwards to binary is like giving up the progress we’ve
>    made since Assembly was created.
>
>
>
> True, I was thinking it may be relatively easy to reuse the Astronaut.glb
> in x3d but now looking at it deeper I see that it is not that easy not only
> because the blob is some binary form but that the data I want is mostly
> trapped in the blob. There aren’t that many triangles and there is careful
> use of color but, I don’t yet see how to extract the x3d code needed for
> one or more child shapes to compose the figure.
>
>
>
> Still, I think there are examples like this in gltf where the asset is
> some data that has been all or partially processed using inputs from
> standard x3d fields, and that any gltf asset has a counterport as an x3d
> field or the result of computing using x3d fields.
>
>
>
> So, the alternative for this is
>
> 1. Just figure how to load the .glb into x3d player and then show how to
> build an annotation system in that space or a child space.
>
> 2. Extract the mesh and materials to x3d user code and get control of the
> thing. (I know bufferviews must mean soething, but how to understand
> “>õ÷²=Ô”)
>
>
>
> I can’t see, for now, how to extract the triangles (I can see them in 3D
> Builder, but can’t modify or save in a readable format.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Joe
>
>
>
> *From: *John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com>
> *Sent: *Saturday, October 8, 2022 2:35 PM
> *To: *Joseph D Williams <joedwil at earthlink.net>
> *Cc: *Vincent Marchetti <vmarchetti at kshell.com>; X3D-Public
> <x3d-public at web3d.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [x3d-public] An annotations example and project
>
>
>
> I am not interested in binary formats, but i have used EXI (ASCII)
>  converters to and from JSON.   See X3DJSONLD.
>
>
>
> JSON schemas might be converted with MapForce.  UAYOR.
>
>
>
> Perhaps there’s some interest in STL and PLY formats?
>
>
>
> AFAIK, .glTF appears to be different than .x3d, and is likely closer to
> .dae.  I am unsure about .glb, i have not approached it.
>
>
>
> Stepping backwards to binary is like giving up the progress we’ve made
> since Assembly was created.
>
>
>
> Perhaps we should consider AssemblyScript?  OBJ is preferable to binary.
>
>
>
> John
>
>
>
> On Sat, Oct 8, 2022 at 3:42 PM Joseph D Williams <joedwil at earthlink.net>
> wrote:
>
> Vincent and John and All, since John and others have been working on ways
> to get x3d transcoded back and forth with json and now typical .glb (GL
> Transmission Format Binary file as Standard json) with prescribed names and
> data form that either are the same or a bit different than standard x3d
> Node names and Field names and X3DField and X3DArrayField data types.
> Except of course, those gl asset blobs that represent binary data that
> would be computed and almost ready to be executed by an x3d player.
>
>
>
> *Is that too simple?
>
> First, does the .glb carry data that would be appropriate to import
> directly with maybe name changes or slightly rearranging or completing data
> for use in a field of a standard x3d field?
>
> Second, are there forms of .glb data, especially for animations, blobs
> that could be expected to be the same as machine-ready input created by x3d
> browser?
>
> Third, I think not likely but please let me know, are there Standard .glb
> data fields that are not used by x3d? Like before the great material
> features added in v4?
>
> Fourth, any other categories?
>
>
>
> That is why the Astronaut.glb file could be very interesting to test. This
> is an opportunity to start with a successful yet static model with overlaid
> authoring interactivity, including some binaries of big data, to be moved
> into x3d space, into a more complete authoring environment, provide some
> animations and improved, maybe even integral rather than overlaid,
> interactive features.
>
>
>
> So, all we need is that graph that shows matching (direct usability)
> between .glb fields and x3d fields. A good AI might construct this table
> from schemas. In particular, what basic scenegraph of x3d nodes can receive
> this particular Astronaut.glb data directly?
>
> Well, also for some glb fields, how to complete or otherwise synthesize
> x3d syntax from glb data.
>
> Finally, to be complete, how an x3d player could use some glb essentially
> precomputed data to allow the x3d player to provide some functionality,
> like animations for an object without performing some internal computing
> steps. If we can add some x3d features and deliver it as .glb …
>
>
>
> So yes, this is reasonable example and thanks for finding it.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Joe
>
>
>
> *From: *Vincent Marchetti <vmarchetti at kshell.com>
> *Sent: *Wednesday, October 5, 2022 9:47 AM
> *To: *Joseph D Williams <joedwil at earthlink.net>; X3D-Public
> <x3d-public at web3d.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [x3d-public] An annotations example and project
>
>
>
> I am not seeing the error message in viewing the astronaut.glb file, with
> Microsoft 3D Viewer at version 7.2107.7012.0, but I do see the error with
> 3D Builder
>
>
>
> I haven't examined the internal structure of the astronaut.glb data, but
> it doesn't surprise me that it is  single mesh item.
>
>
>
> The spirit of this annotation project would be to display the annotations
> from an externally loaded json structure without regard to the detailed
> structure of the 3D asset itself.
>
>
>
> Vince
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Oct 5, 2022, at 12:02 PM, Joseph D Williams <joedwil at earthlink.net>
> wrote:
>
> >
>
> >            • the underlying asset is a glTF asset
>
> >
>
> > Astronaut.glb when downloaded, runs windows 3D Builder with a click and
> allows simple editing. Shows error ‘one or more items invalidly defined.
> Click to repair’ The entire thing is a single ‘item’
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
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>
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>
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>
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>
>
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>
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