[x3d-public] start timer at fraction 0 after scene loading

Sat Sep 9 21:14:02 PDT 2023

Thanks Joe for putting together this example. I can confirm that using
stopTime_changed does not work with x3dom. First I thought it was a
bug but it also does not work with x-ite so there is probably more to
it..

Rereading the spec at
https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4Draft/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-IS.proof/Part01/components/time.html#Timeactivation,
generating a stopTime_changed would fall into 'final events' at the
end of a cycle. But it is actually not clear that stopTime_changed
should be generated according to the spec. The spec. only seems to
refer to stopTime_changed for the case when a set_stopTime event is
received. Which is what both x3dom and x-ite are doing.

So I am now uncertain that stopTime should be used to chain
TimeSensors although it would seem natural.

Instead it is possible to use the isActive field which unequivocally
becomes false at the end of a cycle. Routing isActive through
BooleanFilter to check for false and then TimeTrigger to startTime
then works fine:

https://create3000.github.io/x_ite/playground/?url=https://gist.githubusercontent.com/andreasplesch/3f7ea30b9860b6399c797c51e3235459/raw/c9ddf16c10baa683c7c5cdfbb96db7be4464152b/JoeStarterTest.x3d

https://andreasplesch.github.io/Library/Viewer/index.html?url=https://gist.githubusercontent.com/andreasplesch/3f7ea30b9860b6399c797c51e3235459/raw/c9ddf16c10baa683c7c5cdfbb96db7be4464152b/JoeStarterTest.x3d

Also note that the position of the red ball is arbitrary which seems correct.

Andreas

On Sat, Sep 9, 2023 at 3:36 PM Joe D Williams <joedwil at earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> inline comments
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Andreas Plesch <andreasplesch at gmail.com>
> Sent: Sep 8, 2023 9:27 PM
> To: Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV) <brutzman at nps.edu>
> Cc: X3D Graphics public mailing list <x3d-public at web3d.org>
> Subject: Re: [x3d-public] start timer at fraction 0 after scene loading
>
> > A variation would be for the start timer to self-disable by routing
> its cycleTime through event utilities to set its enabled field to
> false.
>
> Right, I have done that and it works, If I send a false to loop before fraction 1 best results. Seems like the loop false needs to be sent slightly before sequencer fraction 1 to get the timer to stop at last frame.
>
> What I need is to catch the second StartTimer cycleTime to send to MainTimer startTime.
>
> For some reason the StartTimer, when halted like that, does not have a useable stopTime.
> In fact, I can't find a usable stop-Time. This should work:
>
>     <TimeSensor DEF='TIME1' cycleInterval='1' loop='true'/>
>     <TimeSensor DEF='TIME2' cycleInterval='5' loop='false'/>
>     <TimeSensor DEF='TIME3' cycleInterval='10' loop='false'/>:
>    <ROUTE fromField='cycleTime' fromNode='TIME1' toField='set_stopTime' toNode='TIME1'/>
>    <ROUTE fromField='stopTime' fromNode='TIME1' toField='set_startTime' toNode='TIME2'/>
>    <ROUTE fromField='stopTime' fromNode='TIME2' toField='set_startTime' toNode='TIME3'/>
>
> Timer1 should start and be stopped a tic or two after its cycleTime is sent.
> Timer 2 gets started by Timer1 cycleTime (couldn't get Timer1 startTime or stopTime to be usable).
> TImer2 completes at fraction 1 and sends its stopTime to Timer3 startTime.
> Timer 3 starts, then stops at fraction 1.
> Wait, the timer2 stopTime doesn't work like expected, so Timer 3 never Starts.
>
> So, attached is what I have. I don't see why timer3 never gets started.
> Thanks,
> Joe
>
> >  is more verbose but may help a bit with performance since
> the browser then does not need to check stopTime against the actual
> current time at each tick, for a timer which is never used again.
>
> > It would be useful if BooleanFilter would have a triggerFalse field in
> addition to its triggerTrue, in order to switch off things. It could
> be just added without backward compatibility issues. A BooleanFilter
> can invert but it seems arbitrary and unsymmetrical to only have
> triggerTrue. I have a sense of Dejavu since event utilities had been
> discussed before.
>
> Cheers, Andreas
>
> On Fri, Sep 8, 2023 at 3:18 PM Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV)
> wrote:
> >
> > Very interesting, thanks for sharing Andreas. We should all be thinking of regularizing some example design patterns like animation.
> >
> >
> >
> > Meanwhile, your example is the kind that makes me think we should have a description field for ROUTE.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Potential alternative approaches for ROUTE comments:
> >
> >
> >
> > Comments? Sure, but sometimes get stripped, and not unambiguously readable by tools.
> > Prototype extension? Too complex and error prone, fuggedaboutit.
> > Metadata nodes? Hmm, we can't make those part of ROUTE statements themselves, not allowed.
> >
> >
> >
> > Maybe some clumsy-but-unambiguous convention like the following already-legal X3D fragment:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Of course simplest future approach would be to give ROUTE a description field. Hmmm, maybe someday.
> >
> >
> >
> > Might deserve a Mantis issue for X3D4.1 if others agree some potential value exists for future consideation.
> >
> >
> >
> > all the best, Don
> >
> > --
> >
> > Don Brutzman Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br brutzman at nps.edu
> >
> > Watkins 270, MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA +1.831.656.2149
> >
> > X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics https://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: x3d-public On Behalf Of Andreas Plesch
> > Sent: Thursday, September 7, 2023 1:43 PM
> > To: X3D Graphics public mailing list
> > Subject: Re: [x3d-public] start timer at fraction 0 after scene loading
> >
> >
> >
> > Here is an initial count down after loading the scene using the same autostart method, and a sequencer:
> >
> >
> >
> > https://andreasplesch.github.io/Library/Viewer/dev.html?url=https://gist.githubusercontent.com/andreasplesch/3f7ea30b9860b6399c797c51e3235459/raw/d17f9d2a0a258569ac5a474c36a68208674d535e/countdown.x3d
> >
> >
> >
> > https://create3000.github.io/x_ite/playground/?url=https://gist.githubusercontent.com/andreasplesch/3f7ea30b9860b6399c797c51e3235459/raw/d17f9d2a0a258569ac5a474c36a68208674d535e/countdown.x3d
> >
> >
> >
> > -Andreas
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Sep 7, 2023 at 1:01 AM Andreas Plesch wrote:
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Another method apart from a ProximitySensor to start a timer without
> >
> > > user interaction after scene loading is to use two TimeSensors. The
> >
> > > first has loop=true and its only purpose is to trigger the second by
> >
> > > routing its cycleTime to the startTime of the second TimeSensor. The
> >
> > > first also stops itself by routing its cycleTime to its own stopTime.
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Here is an example modified from the cycleTime NIST example:
> >
> > >
> >
> > > https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Frent
> >
> > > ry.co%2Fx3d-startTimer&data=05%7C01%7Cbrutzman%40nps.edu%7C4b415083034
> >
> > > 641d371e608dbafe335ef%7C6d936231a51740ea9199f7578963378e%7C0%7C0%7C638
> >
> > > 297162641403741%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2
> >
> > > luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=v3ah%2F2OY7
> >
> > > NVzEwTUIhRhBjG%2BNHdMZoJTbsC3lEnHR1I%3D&reserved=0
> >
> > >
> >
> > > https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fandr
> >
> > > easplesch.github.io%2FLibrary%2FViewer%2Fdev.html%3Furl%3Dhttps%3A%2F%
> >
> > > 2Fgist.githubusercontent.com%2Fandreasplesch%2F3f7ea30b9860b6399c797c5
> >
> > > 1e3235459%2Fraw%2F118d65438f9cfdc152c01fc5a24a8eccec705511%2FstartTime
> >
> > > r.x3d&data=05%7C01%7Cbrutzman%40nps.edu%7C4b415083034641d371e608dbafe3
> >
> > > 35ef%7C6d936231a51740ea9199f7578963378e%7C0%7C0%7C638297162641403741%7
> >
> > > CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1
> >
> > > haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=m8xOnL%2BHHQy5gXlqLQaec6vBIi
> >
> > > %2BSchjeWtKfYWNDMHw%3D&reserved=0
> >
> > >
> >
> > > --
> >
> > > Andreas Plesch
> >
> > > Waltham, MA 02453
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Andreas Plesch
> >
> > Waltham, MA 02453
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > x3d-public mailing list
> >
> > x3d-public at web3d.org
> >
> > http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org
>
>
>
> --
> Andreas Plesch
> Waltham, MA 02453
>
> _______________________________________________
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> x3d-public at web3d.org
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>

-- 
Andreas Plesch
Waltham, MA 02453