<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12pt"><p style="margin: 0.1rem 0; line-height: 1.0;">> <span style="color: #333333; font-family: helvetica; font-size: 16px; white-space: normal; float: none; display: inline;">A male model - well - that leaves out 50% of the population right there</span> </p>
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<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0; line-height: 1.0;">Hi Carol, It would be great to have two examples, one male and one female style. </p>
<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0; line-height: 1.0;">Of course there should be enough feature points on the surface to be able to dimension either presentation. Are there slightly different points of measurement for the typical male and female.</p>
<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0; line-height: 1.0;">Seems like there should be more points for a female since, well, since different shape and relationship to shoulders and waist(?). </p>
<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0; line-height: 1.0;">Thanks,</p>
<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0; line-height: 1.0;">Joe</p>
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<p>-----Original Message-----<br>From: Carol McDonald <cemd2@comcast.net><br>Sent: Mar 20, 2024 7:03 AM<br>To: Joe D Williams <joedwil@earthlink.net>, John Carlson <yottzumm@gmail.com>, Katy Schildmeyer KS APPAREL DESIGN <katy@ksappareldesign.com><br>Cc: X3D Graphics public mailing list <x3d-public@web3d.org><br>Subject: Re: HAnim Features Points, 1-120 for your review</p>
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<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">My point is the following: it is not "a" male model, but "the" male model as the </span><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">definite article (the) is used before a noun to indicate that the identity of the noun is known to the reader. The indefinite article (a, an) is used before a noun that is general or when its identity is not known. (yes, I had to look this up)</span></div>
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<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-size: 12pt;">Expanding on this: <em>The measurements are appropriate example for a male model drawn 1:1 scale as derived from a collection of actual measurements. The numbers are relative to 0 0 0 at the floor between the feet.</em> </span><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">The measurements are appropriate example for </span><em style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">the</em><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;"> model that was drawn 1:1 scale with </span><em style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">the</em><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;"> known symmetrical </span><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">body shape, </span><span style="font-size: 12pt;">as derived from a collection of actual measurements taken off of <em>the</em> virtual humanoid that is </span><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">in the required I pose, in the x,y,z ordination as required by HAnim, with origin at 0,0,0 between the feet. </span></div>
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<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">A male model - well - that leaves out 50% of the population right there. </span></div>
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<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">I am not saying the translations are wrong - just more limited in actual application than first thought. So I can give more translations but I need a way to get the skin surface into Rhino. If we can get the skin surface into Blender - from Blender, then save as an OBJ file that I can import into Rhino - I can get the translations. But the underbust will be an approximation as there is no curve changes on the front side of the body. </span></div>
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<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">Carol </span></div>
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<div>On 03/20/2024 1:29 AM PDT Joe D Williams <joedwil@earthlink.net> wrote:</div>
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<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0; line-height: 1.0;">> <span style="color: #333333; font-family: helvetica; font-size: 16px; white-space: normal; float: none; display: inline;"> the distance of that model from the origin and are not appropriate for Gramps or any other model.</span> </p>
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<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0; line-height: 1.0;">The measurements are appropriate example for a male model drawn 1:1 scale as derived from a collection of actual measurements. The numbers are relative to 0 0 0 at the floor between the feet. </p>
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<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0; line-height: 1.0;">Maybe we need to discuss this live to clarify some details. </p>
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<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0; line-height: 1.0;">Thanks, </p>
<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0; line-height: 1.0;">Joe</p>
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<p>-----Original Message-----<br>From: Carol McDonald <cemd2@comcast.net><br>Sent: Mar 16, 2024 7:08 AM<br>To: John Carlson <yottzumm@gmail.com>, Joe D Williams <joedwil@earthlink.net><br>Cc: X3D Graphics public mailing list <x3d-public@web3d.org><br>Subject: Re: HAnim Features Points, 1-120 for your review</p>
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<div style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">I have been looking into this. And I am agreeing with John's assessment. I will somehow need to get everything into Rhino for visualization and coding. </span></div>
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<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">From John on March 14th. </span></div>
<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">I am thinking that humanoid_root and all other joint centers are relative to the LCS (local coordinate system) of the humanoid, which is 0, 0, 0 relative to any transforms outside the humanoid.<br></span>
<div>That's my best guess right now.</div>
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<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">What is not noted on the General is the exact file or model for which these translations were built for. This means that the list of the translations on the website only valid for the humanoid model that they were obtained for, the distance of that model from the origin and are not appropriate for Gramps or any other model. </span></div>
<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"> </div>
<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">This means that for every joint center and every translation, it would be good to have reason for why is it located where it is. </span></div>
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<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;"><a href="https://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19774-1/V2.0/Architecture/BodyDimensionsAndLOAs.html#General">https://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19774-1/V2.0/Architecture/BodyDimensionsAndLOAs.html#General</a></span></div>
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<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;"><a href="https://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19774-1/V2.0/Architecture/BodyDimensionsAndLOAs.html#LOA2DefaultSiteTranslations">https://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19774-1/V2.0/Architecture/BodyDimensionsAndLOAs.html#LOA2DefaultSiteTranslations</a></span></div>
<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;"><a href="https://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19774-1/V2.0/Architecture/BodyDimensionsAndLOAs.html#LOA3DefaultSiteTranslations">https://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19774-1/V2.0/Architecture/BodyDimensionsAndLOAs.html#LOA3DefaultSiteTranslations</a></span></div>
<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;"><a href="https://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19774-1/V2.0/Architecture/BodyDimensionsAndLOAs.html#LOA4DefaultSiteTranslations">https://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19774-1/V2.0/Architecture/BodyDimensionsAndLOAs.html#LOA4DefaultSiteTranslations</a></span></div>
<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"> </div>
<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">Is this the model for which the translations are built for? Can someone send me the proper link? Is this it? I will see if I can import it into Rhino 8. </span></div>
<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;"><span style="font-family: helvetica; font-size: 12pt;">HumanoidAnimation/Skin/Joe*.x3d </span></div>
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<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica, arial, sans-serif; color: #333333;">Back to updating every 120 points currently listed as to recommendations of how to locate it and adding the additional feature points that I have requested. </div>
<div class="default-style" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica, arial, sans-serif; color: #333333;"><a href="https://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19774-1/V2.0/Architecture/FeaturePoints.html#FeaturePointsOnTheHumanBody">https://www.web3d.org/documents/specifications/19774-1/V2.0/Architecture/FeaturePoints.html#FeaturePointsOnTheHumanBody</a></div>
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<div>Carol </div>
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<div>On 03/16/2024 4:23 AM PDT John Carlson <yottzumm@gmail.com> wrote:</div>
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<div class="gmail_attr" dir="ltr">On Sat, Mar 16, 2024 at 2:38 AM Joe D Williams <<a href="mailto:joedwil@earthlink.net">joedwil@earthlink.net</a>> wrote:</div>
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<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0px; line-height: 1;">> You can make the skin opaque to see that I'm really grabbing this from a HumanoidAnimation/Skin/Joe*.x3d example, just my own incantation of scripts to draw the humanoid geometry. I'll be checking those in soon</p>
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<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0px; line-height: 1;">Great John,</p>
<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0px; line-height: 1;">I will check this out soon. </p>
<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0px; line-height: 1;">Any ideas for the 'virtual' feature points? </p>
<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0px; line-height: 1;">All Fine, </p>
<p style="margin: 0.1rem 0px; line-height: 1;">Joe</p>
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<div>Joe, do you mean user drawn, not in current standard? User defined points? I have scripts for sites to place coordinates, but I don't have a way to get them into the hierarchy yet, so...</div>
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<p>-----Original Message-----<br>From: John Carlson <<a href="mailto:yottzumm@gmail.com" target="_blank" rel="noopener">yottzumm@gmail.com</a>><br>Sent: Mar 15, 2024 12:11 AM<br>To: X3D Graphics public mailing list <<a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" target="_blank" rel="noopener">x3d-public@web3d.org</a>>, Carol McDonald <<a href="mailto:cemd2@comcast.net" target="_blank" rel="noopener">cemd2@comcast.net</a>>, Joe D Williams <<a href="mailto:joedwil@earthlink.net" target="_blank" rel="noopener">joedwil@earthlink.net</a>><br>Subject: Re: HAnim Features Points, 1-120 for your review</p>
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<div dir="ltr">Carol, I'm discovering it makes a difference where you put the Transform in the HAnimSegment as to whether to reuse the center. I don't have something that doesn't put out warnings yet, or takes the Sites away from the Joints. Hmm!
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<div>My best Humanoid so far is Humanoid4J.x3d.</div>
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<div>I'm going to get some sleep.</div>
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<div class="gmail_attr" dir="ltr">On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 12:53 AM John Carlson <<a href="mailto:yottzumm@gmail.com" target="_blank" rel="noopener">yottzumm@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div>
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<div dir="ltr">Good use of Billboard for annotated feature points
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<div>Please consider this a contribution to the Web3DConsortium examples. I release my copyright and licensing privileges, and give them copyright and licensing under the normal X3D resources example.</div>
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<div>Thanks to Joe and Don for good examples to draw from!</div>
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<div>No, I don't have any metadata yet. Let's set up a time and figure out who all contributed.</div>
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<div>You can make the skin opaque to see that I'm really grabbing this from a HumanoidAnimation/Skin/Joe*.x3d example, just my own incantation of scripts to draw the humanoid geometry. I'll be checking those in soon.</div>
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<div>John</div>
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