<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Hi John,</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">I am not sure, if it is useful to start such discussion, however I took your answer as a trigger to rename the subject of this mail and start a discussion about VR vs. XR.</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">First, I googled it and actually you are right (as expected). XR means "extended" reality, it does not mean "any" reality, what I thought it meant.</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">On a first glance, the term "extended reality" sounds weird, because we cannot "create" reality. We can just take matter/energy and space/time and transform it into "something else".</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Also, the bits and bytes in a Web3D Browser and the pixels in the HMD are just "parts of the reality" that have been transformed by mankind, as any technology. They just have been transformed into something that is perceived as "something new" by the user.</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Now, if we take the perception of the user as the scale for being "something new", "something, that extends reality", then the "Good old VR" can be taken as XR, too.</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">In this sense, a "good old book", would be XR, too, just it does not provide computer generated 3D graphics.</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">On the other hand, I could state, that any XR experience is built by two components (I am not sure, comments are welcome):</span></div>
<ul>
<li style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">perceptions that are provided by "some technological faility" (what I would call VR)</span></li>
<li style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">perceptions that are directly provided by the "real" reality (what I would call RR)</span></li>
</ul>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">The difference between the different types of XR (i.e. VR, AR, MR, ......) would then be just HOW those two components are combined and HOW the computer provided perceptions are synchronized with the "real" reality.</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Let me repeat my (updated) definition of VR and RR in the P.S., and let me state that I am not reluctant to completely replace the term VR by the term XR in my glossary.</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Have a nice weekend</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Christoph</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">P.S.: from the "glossary of SrrTrains v0.01"</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Reality, Virtual Reality, Real Reality<br></span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">There is only one reality, but every person carries an own<br>model of the reality in his/her/its mind.<br></span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">This model helps the person to foresee the future evolution of<br>the reality and it helps the person to induce changes to the<br>reality according to his/her/its will.<br></span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Virtual reality is a part of the reality that is implemented by<br>means of technology and that helps one or more persons (see<br>user) to visit a virtual scene that needs not be directly related<br>or connected to the real reality.</span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Strictly spoken, an ancient form of virtual reality is already to<br>sit around the camp fire telling stories. Also books and movies<br>form kinds of virtual reality.<br></span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Usually we use the narrow term of virtual reality, if some<br>minimum technological requirements are fulfilled, e.g. the<br>usage of stereoscopic realtime computer graphics.<br></span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">We use the term real reality to denote all parts of the reality<br>that are not part of the virtual reality in question, but that are<br>of relevance for that virtual reality.<br></span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;"> </span></div>
<div style="font-family: 'verdana'; font-size: 12px; color: #000;"><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Anything else is just the reality</span></div>
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<div><strong>Gesendet: </strong>Freitag, 2. Mai 2025 um 15:03</div>
<div><strong>Von: </strong>"Christoph Valentin" <christoph.valentin@gmx.at></div>
<div><strong>An: </strong>"John Carlson" <yottzumm@gmail.com>, "Extensible 3D (X3D) Graphics public discussion" <x3d-public@web3d.org></div>
<div><strong>CC: </strong>h-anim@web3d.org,hanim@web3d.org</div>
<div><strong>Betreff: </strong>Aw: Re: [x3d-public] Re: Re: Re: Re: What is the metaverse?</div>
</div>
It's funny, I always read XR = any reality, but not extended reality<br><br>
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<div class="mail_android_quote" style="line-height: 1;"><br>Am 02.05.25, 14:28 schrieb Christoph Valentin via x3d-public <x3d-public@<a href="http://web3d.org" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">web3d.org</a>>:
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<h3 style="box-sizing: border-box; min-width: 0.0px; margin-top: 20.0px; margin-bottom: 10.0px; background-color: #ffffff;"><span id="en-NIV-268" class="text Gen-11-1">The Tower of Babel</span></h3>
<p class="chapter-2" style="box-sizing: border-box; min-width: 0.0px; font-size: 16.0px; background-color: #ffffff;"><span class="text Gen-11-1"><span class="chapternum" style="font-weight: bold; position: relative; line-height: 0.8em; bottom: -0.1em; left: 0.0px; display: inline;">11 </span>Now the whole world had one language and a common speech.</span> <span id="en-NIV-269" class="text Gen-11-2"><span class="versenum" style="line-height: normal; position: relative; vertical-align: text-top; top: auto; font-weight: bold; display: inline;">2 </span>As people moved eastward,<span class="footnote" style="font-size: 0.625em; line-height: normal; position: relative; vertical-align: text-top; top: auto; display: inline;">[<a style="box-sizing: border-box; min-width: 0.0px; color: #4a4a4a; vertical-align: text-top;" title="See footnote a" href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%2011%3A1-9&version=NIV#fen-NIV-269a" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">a</a>]</span> they found a plain in Shinar<span class="footnote" style="font-size: 0.625em; line-height: normal; position: relative; vertical-align: text-top; top: auto; display: inline;">[<a style="box-sizing: border-box; min-width: 0.0px; color: #4a4a4a; vertical-align: text-top;" title="See footnote b" href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%2011%3A1-9&version=NIV#fen-NIV-269b" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">b</a>]</span> and settled there.</span></p>
<p style="box-sizing: border-box; min-width: 0.0px; font-size: 16.0px; background-color: #ffffff;"><span id="en-NIV-270" class="text Gen-11-3"><span class="versenum" style="line-height: normal; position: relative; vertical-align: text-top; top: auto; font-weight: bold; display: inline;">3 </span>They said to each other, “Come, let’s make bricks and bake them thoroughly.” They used brick instead of stone, and tar for mortar.</span> <span id="en-NIV-271" class="text Gen-11-4"><span class="versenum" style="line-height: normal; position: relative; vertical-align: text-top; top: auto; font-weight: bold; display: inline;">4 </span>Then they said, “Come, let us build ourselves a city, with a tower that reaches to the heavens, so that we may make a name for ourselves; otherwise we will be scattered over the face of the whole earth.”</span></p>
<p style="box-sizing: border-box; min-width: 0.0px; font-size: 16.0px; background-color: #ffffff;"><span id="en-NIV-272" class="text Gen-11-5"><span class="versenum" style="line-height: normal; position: relative; vertical-align: text-top; top: auto; font-weight: bold; display: inline;">5 </span>But the <span class="small-caps">Lord</span> came down to see the city and the tower the people were building.</span> <span id="en-NIV-273" class="text Gen-11-6"><span class="versenum" style="line-height: normal; position: relative; vertical-align: text-top; top: auto; font-weight: bold; display: inline;">6 </span>The <span class="small-caps">Lord</span> said, “If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them.</span> <span id="en-NIV-274" class="text Gen-11-7"><span class="versenum" style="line-height: normal; position: relative; vertical-align: text-top; top: auto; font-weight: bold; display: inline;">7 </span>Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other.”</span></p>
<p style="box-sizing: border-box; min-width: 0.0px; font-size: 16.0px; background-color: #ffffff;"><span id="en-NIV-275" class="text Gen-11-8"><span class="versenum" style="line-height: normal; position: relative; vertical-align: text-top; top: auto; font-weight: bold; display: inline;">8 </span>So the <span class="small-caps">Lord</span> scattered them from there over all the earth, and they stopped building the city.</span> <span id="en-NIV-276" class="text Gen-11-9"><span class="versenum" style="line-height: normal; position: relative; vertical-align: text-top; top: auto; font-weight: bold; display: inline;">9 </span>That is why it was called Babel<span class="footnote" style="font-size: 0.625em; line-height: normal; position: relative; vertical-align: text-top; top: auto; display: inline;">[<a style="box-sizing: border-box; min-width: 0.0px; color: #4a4a4a; vertical-align: text-top;" title="See footnote c" href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%2011%3A1-9&version=NIV#fen-NIV-276c" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">c</a>]</span>—because there the <span class="small-caps">Lord</span> confused the language of the whole world. From there the <span class="small-caps">Lord</span> scattered them over the face of the whole earth.</span></p>
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<div class="mail_android_quote" style="line-height: 1;"><br>Am 02.05.25, 14:03 schrieb John Carlson <yottzumm@<a href="http://gmail.com" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">gmail.com</a>>:
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<div>XR = VR + AR + MR + objective reality</div>
<div> </div>
<div>XR is extended reality. Google it.</div>
<div> </div>
<div> XR devices are used to enter the metaverse, webiverse, the external world. There’s already OpenXR and WebXR standards.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Come out and see what’s outside the Cave.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>What we haven’t handled yet is subjective reality. Ideal reality? IR? Yes, UR.</div>
<div><br>
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<div class="gmail_attr">On Fri, May 2, 2025 at 6:49 AM Christoph Valentin via x3d-public <<a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">x3d-public@web3d.org</a>> wrote:</div>
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<div>Correction:<br><br>I mean, MR does not "extend" reality, it's just a special part of reality, which deals with immersive, interactive, multiuser story telling, command and control<br><br>
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<div style="line-height: 1;"><br>Am 02.05.25, 13:41 schrieb Christoph Valentin via x3d-public <x3d-public@<a href="http://web3d.org" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">web3d.org</a>>:</div>
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<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0.8ex 0.0pt 0.0pt 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1.0px; border-left-style: solid; padding-left: 1.0ex; border-left-color: #cccccc;">The "metaverse" is the thing, that is perceived by the user, but that's nothing, that must be specified<br><br>
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<div style="line-height: 1;"><br>Am 02.05.25, 13:33 schrieb Christoph Valentin via x3d-public <x3d-public@<a href="http://web3d.org" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">web3d.org</a>>:
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0.8ex 0.0pt 0.0pt 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1.0px; border-left-style: solid; padding-left: 1.0ex; border-left-color: #cccccc;">Hi,<br><br>I like "mixed reality = virtual reality + real reality".<br><br>I mean, VR does not "extend" reality, it's just a special part of reality, which deals with immersive, interactive story telling, command and control<br><br>
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<div style="line-height: 1;"><br>Am 30.04.25, 20:33 schrieb John Carlson via x3d-public <x3d-public@<a href="http://web3d.org" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">web3d.org</a>>:
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<div>I kind of like “Spatial Internet” is to Metaverse/World as Internet is to Website.</div>
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<div>Perhaps “extended-reality” would be better than “virtual-reality.” Meaning we’ve extended beyond mere VR into other accessible media including the passive and active external environments.</div>
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<div>This means that real objects with behaviors can be brought into each metaverse, and many metaverses can be viewed in the metaverse, and state can transfer between metaverses via the external environments.</div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div>XRML anyone?</div>
<div><br>
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<div class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Apr 30, 2025 at 1:06 PM Joe D Williams via x3d-public <<a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">x3d-public@web3d.org</a>> wrote:</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1.0px; border-left-style: solid; padding-left: 1.0ex; border-left-color: #cccccc;"><br>This XR idea of our blossoming metaverse to integrate <br>realtime Spatial anchors and assets of the current reality <br>with realtime Scene anchors and assets of the current virtuality <br>means the metaverse definition of our Immersive Web<br>needs to be extended. <br><br>From Google Dictionary <br>(Current) Definition from Oxford Languages · <br>met·a·verse <br>/ˈmedəˌvərs/ <br>noun Computing <br><br>"a virtual-reality space in which users can interact with<br>a computer-generated environment and other users"<br><br>New Extended Candidate: <br>metaverse or webiverse or webimetaverse, or whatever, you get the idea. <br><br>"a virtual-reality space in which a user can interact with <br>the real external environment, <br>a computer-generated environment, <br>and other real and virtual users" <br><br>All Good for the WWW,<br>Joe<br><br>_______________________________________________<br>x3d-public mailing list<br><a href="mailto:x3d-public@web3d.org" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">x3d-public@web3d.org</a><br><a href="http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org</a></blockquote>
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