[x3d-public] Finding more than one use of a DEF in VRML

[John Carlson]

Maybe I'm confused.  Are node names

name="node name"

or

DEF="node name"

I've been using "DEF value" for "DEF keyword" I think.

I think if the DEF keyword is not unique with in a scope, my ProtoExpander
will blow big chunks, but I'll have to check.

There were many discussions on the mailing list about this, and maybe I
didn't understand because I wasn't phrasing the question properly.

In some cases in the wrl previously reported, the DEF keyword is not unique
in the source file, but I didn't check for the source (that is, I didn't
inspect the source file very much), there could be additional scope stuff
like a PROTO.

John

On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 7:25 AM Michalis Kamburelis <
michalis.kambi at gmail.com> wrote:

> I have to correct myself -- I see x3d 3.3 specification says """Node names
> shall be unique in the context within which the associated DEF keyword
> occurs."""
>
> All right, that's good. Looks like this rule was improved at some x3d
> version. That's good, it is a better idea to have all names unique (e.g.
> for easy EXPORT).
>
> It still remains a question why did my converter generate repeated DEF. It
> should not, if source VRML didn't repeat them. I'll look into it -- please
> send input to reproduce it:)
>
> Regards,
> Michalis
>
> W dniu czw., 26.03.2020 o 12:09 Michalis Kamburelis <
> michalis.kambi at gmail.com> napisał(a):
>
>> As I mentioned in the other thread, multiple DEF with the same name
>> are just allowed by the X3D specification. Last one "wins" (obscuring
>> the others with the same name). Maybe they should be disallowed or
>> discouraged, it's another discussion. But right now they are allowed
>> and proper VRML / X3D reader should understand them.
>>
>> As to why my exporter created them -- I need to see the relevant input
>> file to answer it. There should be a good reason for it :)
>>
>> Regards,
>> Michalis
>>
>> czw., 26 mar 2020 o 06:30 John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com> napisał(a):
>> >
>> > DEF/USE is how multiparent nodes are achieved, but all DEF and USE with
>> the same value are the same node, except for a few special cases.
>> >
>> > This is what one reason why HTML DOM is a poor choice...the nodes have
>> only one parent.
>> >
>> > Or I’m still battling windmills?
>> >
>> > John
>> >
>> > On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 10:16 PM GPU Group <gpugroup at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> double defining:
>> >> - this stymied me too, until I realized the DEF/USE are just for the
>> parser, and its the sequence that counts although different for different
>> browsers.
>> >> - if you redef 3 times, then USE, what will you get?
>> >> - that depends on the web3d browser, with some sticking to the first
>> DEF, some the last DEF.
>> >>
>> >> On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 9:01 PM John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> If one DEF specified a shape and another DEF with the same value with
>> a different shape, wouldn't the 2 browsers show different shapes if they
>> picked different DEFs?
>> >>>
>> >>> I don't think double DEFs should be allowed within the same namespace.
>> >>>
>> >>> John
>> >>>
>> >>> On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 9:12 PM GPU Group <gpugroup at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Chisel? "it was simply put in the public domain by Trapezium when
>> they folded many years ago. They didn¹t specify any license" - Louka
>> >>>> http://dug9.users.sourceforge.net/web3d/temp/chisel-src.zip
>> >>>> But I suspect double-deffing isn't illegal. I think I've been
>> through it, and different browsers honored the first or last definition.
>> >>>> -Doug
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 7:43 PM John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> That is, more than one DEF with the same value.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> I realize that separate PROTOs may have the same DEF due to
>> namespaces.   Unfortunately writing a Unix script to find this takes
>> massive brain power.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> John
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 8:37 PM John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> I’m not particular looking for a vrml parser unless it catches
>> double use of a DEF.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Thanks,
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> John
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> I’m thinking my next project might be a VRML validator if there
>> isn’t one handy?  Anyone?
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> I know I can translate VRML to XML.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> John
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 3:38 PM John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Say, where is a VRML Validator? !!!!
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 3:33 PM John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> I will download X3D-Edit and do some validation on the files, or
>> go to the validation site @ savage
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> _______________________________________________
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>> >>>>
>> >>>> _______________________________________________
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>> >
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>
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