[x3d-public] MIDI suggestions

GPU Group gpugroup at gmail.com
Fri Aug 23 07:18:30 PDT 2024


Don,
MIDI via PROTOs > working in C I used threads and queues between the MIDI
port and the x3d rendering thread, and I don't know how to do that with
PROTOs. But it might be different with Web MIDI API. So one idea is to wait
until/in-case one of the web based x3d browsers implements a MIDI component
using PROTOs, and see how they did that, and then the native browsers can
adapt to that.
-Doug

On Thu, Aug 22, 2024 at 6:35 PM Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV) <
brutzman at nps.edu> wrote:

> Understood.  The work you describe regarding MIDI nodes looks quite
> involved.  Possible component extension if someone did the work involved.
> Implementing as Prototype library using Script nodes might work.  Writing
> extensions for X_ITE or X3DOM might work.  In each case that would be
> proof-of-capability and maybe not a path to wide availability.
>
> I think it is doubtful that MIDI editing would be accepted as a high-value
> use case and recommended practice for X3D 4.1, which might take an
> undetermined length of time anyway.  Seems like a long, unlikely and
> unsatisfying path to pursue.  Nevertheless possible.
>
> I looked in Audacity briefly for "saving as" MIDI ASCII but didn't find
> it.  Perhaps I missed it or another tool is useful.
>
> If we do have a text-base example MIDI file archived, that might encourage
> use of other online editors.  Note how X_ITE is already able to show XML,
> ClassicVRML and JSON encodings equivalently (see links in upper-right
> corner).
>
>
>    - X_ITE Playground Editor
>    - X3D Example Archives: X3D4WA, X3D for Web Authors, Chapter 05
>    Appearance Material Textures, Pixel Texture Snowman
>    -
>    https://create3000.github.io/x_ite/playground/?url=https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dForWebAuthors/Chapter05AppearanceMaterialTextures/PixelTextureSnowman.x3d
>
>
>
>    - ... but has error:  Couldn't load URL '
>    https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dForWebAuthors/Chapter05AppearanceMaterialTextures/frosty2.mid'.EncodingError:
>    Failed to execute 'decodeAudioData' on 'BaseAudioContext': Unable to decode
>    audio data
>
>
>
>    - X3DOM similarly seems to have a problem paying the midi file
>    -
>    https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dForWebAuthors/Chapter05AppearanceMaterialTextures/PixelTextureSnowmanX3dom.xhtml
>
>
>
>    - Nothing heard using latest FreeWrl
>    - Nothing heard using current Castle Model Viewer
>
>
> Audacity plays the .midi file OK.  Might there be a problem with the file?
>
> Regarding sound-related implementations, am hoping we get more examples
> and start showing compelling implementation support for the Web Audio API
> nodes that are already added to the X3D 4.0 Sound Component.  Huge but
> unrealized potential is already available to us...
>
>
>    -  Spatial Sound in X3DOM with Web Audio API
>    - https://medialab.hmu.gr/minipages/x3domAudio
>
>
>
>    - X3D Example Archives: X3D4AM, X3D for Advanced Modeling, Audio
>    Spatial Sound
>    -
>    https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dForAdvancedModeling/AudioSpatialSound/
>
>
> Again thanks for pushing on the limits, hope these potential paths forward
> can help us focus further progress.
>
>
> all the best, Don
>
> --
>
> Don Brutzman  Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br
> brutzman at nps.edu
>
> Watkins 270,  MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA
> +1.831.656.2149
>
> X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics
> https://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* GPU Group <gpugroup at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 22, 2024 11:20 AM
> *To:* Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV) <brutzman at nps.edu>
> *Cc:* Extensible 3D (X3D) Graphics public discussion <x3d-public at web3d.org
> >
> *Subject:* Re: [x3d-public] MIDI suggestions
>  .
> Don,
> The current Sound component doesn't have a way to look at each MIDI note
> as an event, nor to create MIDI notes with events during scene execution.
> See this proposed separate 43 MIDI Component which allows that.
> https://freewrl.sourceforge.io/tests/43_MIDI/
> freewrl.sourceforge.io/tests/43_MIDI/NOTES_midi.txt
> -Doug
>
> On Thu, Aug 22, 2024 at 11:16 AM Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV) <
> brutzman at nps.edu> wrote:
>
> Doug, thanks for your suggestions.
>
> Regarding MIDI support:
>
>
>    - *X3D 4.0 Architecture, 16 Sound component, 16.4.2 AudioClip*
>    -
>    https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-IS/Part01/components/sound.html#AudioClip
>    - The *url* field specifies the URL from which the sound file is
>    loaded. 16.2.6 Audio encoding formats
>    <https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-IS/Part01/components/sound.html#AudioEncodingFormats> describes
>    required and recommended file format support. 9.2.1 URLs, URNs and URIs
>    <https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-IS/Part01/components/networking.html#URLs> contains
>    details on the *url* field.
>
>
>
>    - *X3D 4.0 Architecture, 16 Sound component, 16.2.6 Audio encoding
>    formats*
>    -
>    https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-IS/Part01/components/sound.html#AudioEncodingFormats
>
> X3D browsers shall support at least the *wavefile* format in uncompressed
> PCM format (see [WAV]
> <https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-IS/Part01/bibliography.html#WAV>
> ).
> It is recommended that X3D browsers support the MIDI file type 1 sound
> format (see [MIDI 1.0]
> <https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-IS/Part01/references.html#MIDI-1>).
> MIDI files are presumed to use the General MIDI patch set.
> X3D browser support is also recommended for MIDI 2.0 (see [MIDI 2.0]
> <https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-IS/Part01/references.html#MIDI-2> and
> Web MIDI API (see [W3C-WebMIDI]
> <https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-IS/Part01/references.html#W3C-WebMIDI>
> ).
> It is also recommended that X3D browsers support the following formats:
>
>    - Format=MP3, container=MP3, compressed (see [I11172-1]
>    <https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-IS/Part01/references.html#I11172_1>
>    ).
>    - Format=AAC, container=MP4 (see [14496-14]
>    <https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3Dv4/ISO-IEC19775-1v4-IS/Part01/references.html#14496_14>
>    ).
>
> Example X3Dscene with MIDI content:
>
>    - X3D Example Archives: X3D4WA, X3D for Web Authors, Chapter 05
>    Appearance Material Textures, Pixel Texture Snowman
>    -
>    https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dForWebAuthors/Chapter05AppearanceMaterialTextures/PixelTextureSnowmanIndex.html
>    -
>    https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dForWebAuthors/Chapter05AppearanceMaterialTextures/PixelTextureSnowman.x3d
>    -
>    https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dForWebAuthors/Chapter05AppearanceMaterialTextures/frosty2.mid
>
>
> Regarding MIDI content in ASCII form, it is certainly not disallowed in
> the X3D specification.   Might you please send some references and an
> example?  Perhaps an ASCII plaintext version of frosty2.
>
> Have fun with X3D and MIDI!  8)
>
> all the best, Don
>
> --
>
> Don Brutzman  Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br
> brutzman at nps.edu
>
> Watkins 270,  MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA
> +1.831.656.2149
>
> X3D graphics, virtual worlds, navy robotics
> https://faculty.nps.edu/brutzman
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* x3d-public <x3d-public-bounces at web3d.org> on behalf of GPU Group
> via x3d-public <x3d-public at web3d.org>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 21, 2024 3:14 PM
> *To:* Extensible 3D (X3D) Graphics public discussion <x3d-public at web3d.org
> >
> *Cc:* GPU Group <gpugroup at gmail.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [x3d-public] Web3D 2024: HAnim Music Animation competition
> - Win cash prizes!
>
> MIDI > at least one web3d browser supports MIDI with nodes that give
> events, which could be used to synchronize HAnim motions to music tones /
> beats, or vice versa.
> Something missing from prior work: a node that holds MIDI directly in
> ASCII format, for easy tinkering in X3D scene file.
> -Doug
>
>
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