[x3d-public] Plans for proceeding with C/C++/C# specification and implementation
John Carlson
yottzumm at gmail.com
Tue Jan 25 16:24:25 PST 2022
I'm seeing: "XSLT Interactive Debuggger/XSLT Debugger for VSCode," but it
only gets 2 stars? Are there any other line-by-line debuggers?
On Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 5:35 PM GPU Group <gpugroup at gmail.com> wrote:
> VS Code has plugins called 'Extensions'. When you open it, on the left
> there's a vertical menu bar and one of them is for Extensions.
> Click that and shop away.
> -Doiug
>
> On Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 4:30 PM John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Some nice things which might be in a possible XSLT tool:
>>
>> * works with concrete examples, from multiple targets to multiple
>> sources. I’m imagining something like XslByDemo (IBM), but separating
>> source from target.
>>
>> * both declarative (recursion) and imperative (loops, conditions)
>>
>> * documentation of rules in stylesheet easy to extract (meta-XSLT).
>>
>> * code coverage
>>
>> * minimal or humble cost
>>
>>
>> I have mostly on used command-line tools for compiling c/c++ on Windows
>> XP back around 2001. I used both gnu and Microsoft command line tools.
>> I have very little experience with Visual Studio or VS Code.
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 4:59 PM John Carlson <yottzumm at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> My constraints right now are 1) my health, which has been discussed—I
>>> definitely have COVID 2) appropriate tools for writing and documenting
>>> XSLT. I don’t think that vim/nvim is going to cut it, and wife doesn’t
>>> want to talk about spending $200 right now. Recommendations for free or
>>> open source software (no spyware or malware please) welcome. I have not
>>> tested any freely available tools for this, I would appreciate
>>> recommendations that run on Windows 10.
>>>
>>> John
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 4:34 PM Brutzman, Donald (Don) (CIV) <
>>> brutzman at nps.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Summary. We plan to proceed carefully with C/C++/C# specification and
>>>> implementation.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Further assistance will be much appreciated, we are time limited.
>>>> There are major opportunities here for people to learn and contribute.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Here are extensive notes from our discussion.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Discussion 1.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dick and I remain blocked by X3D4 architecture document work and
>>>> cannot work on those document, only support. So we need two individuals:
>>>> an editor, and we need an implementor.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> John Carlson might be willing to assist as an implementer for second
>>>> implementation (autogenerated from X3DUOM).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> We were also wondering if your code can be placed in an open-source
>>>> license, perhaps by Web3D Consortium. (Answer yes, that is done)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Whoever helps with code needs to be capable of compiling and testing
>>>> the results with our examples. Neither Dick nor I are capable of spending
>>>> time for that. Without full testing, we cannot be confident that
>>>> everything is OK.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> If you are willing to work with me on XSLT then that is a possible
>>>> path, but my time is still highly overcommitted due to emergent
>>>> responsibilities at work. So I would love to proceed with you, but I am
>>>> really worried that my duties will not allow us to succeed together.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I recommend that we find one more person to help who is a good C, C++
>>>> C# programmer, then we can carefully proceed.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Web3D rules are clear that we need 2 implementations. Your existing
>>>> codebase can be one implementation, the X3DUOM-generated source can be a
>>>> second implementation. Yes they will probably be very similar, but that
>>>> will let us follow the rules.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dick and I can assist anyone who joins in the work, but we do need
>>>> another active person to proceed.
>>>>
>>>> Our rules can be found at https://www.web3d.org/standards
>>>>
>>>> Standards Adoption Process
>>>> https://www.web3d.org/standards/adoption-process
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> For that process, since we are extending existing work, sections 1-4
>>>> are essentially complete.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> For Section 5. Create Standard or Extension, we especially need '5.
>>>> Identify at least two independent and interoperable implementations (at
>>>> least one should be open source)'
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Inventory of what is needed next:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> a. Suwon source accessible (preferably under open-source license, such
>>>> as Web3D license)
>>>>
>>>> b. Use X3D Unified Object Model (X3DUOM) via XSLT to create another
>>>> independent codebase (similar to X3DJSAIL, X3DPSAIL, X3D Ontology)
>>>>
>>>> https://www.web3d.org/specifications/X3DUOM.html
>>>>
>>>> c. Create an X3dToCpp.xslt and X3dToCsharp.xslt stylesheets to convert
>>>> .x3d models into source code (again similar to Java, Python, Turtle)
>>>>
>>>> d. When those converters are successfully testing the codebase against
>>>> some .x3d models, then we can apply them to all 4000 models in the X3D
>>>> Example Archives. That provides full coverage of correctness. See any of
>>>> the models at
>>>>
>>>> https://www.web3d.org/x3d/content/examples/X3dResources.html#Examples
>>>>
>>>> e. Notice that such testing requires a C/C++/C# expert who can identify
>>>> flaws and potential fixes. (Neither Dick nor I have that expertise)
>>>>
>>>> f. Native C/C++/C# Viewers not required to confirm correctness of data
>>>> structures when performing conversions correctly… If someone wants to add
>>>> that to the open source, they are welcome.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Discussion 2
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> MWL says
>>>>
>>>> - Her existing C, C++, C## source was already placed under
>>>> a Web3D Consortium Open Source license in 2019
>>>>
>>>> - She would like to proceed with all three versions for C,
>>>> C++, C#
>>>>
>>>> - Licenses at
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> https://sourceforge.net/p/x3d/code/HEAD/tree/www.web3d.org
>>>>
>>>> - Older versions of Suwon code is already checked in and
>>>> can get updated at
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> https://sourceforge.net/p/x3d/code/HEAD/tree/www.web3d.org/x3d/languages
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> We discussed how
>>>>
>>>> - Autogenerated cpp and csharp libraries will go in
>>>> following location
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> https://sourceforge.net/p/x3d/code/HEAD/tree/www.web3d.org/x3d/stylesheets
>>>>
>>>> - Don will discuss with Dick if one hour per week of shared
>>>> time is possible… we agreed to try.
>>>>
>>>> - Myeong can do much of this work, and might be able to
>>>> attract student(s) or another professional to help
>>>>
>>>> - Let's meet again in two weeks (perhaps at same time)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Next meeting:
>>>>
>>>> - Tuesday FEB 8, 1300 pacific
>>>> - Wednesday FEB 9, 0600 Korea
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> We will use x3d-public mailing list to report periodic progress.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for your patience and your many efforts. We will keep trying.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> all the best, Don
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Don Brutzman Naval Postgraduate School, Code USW/Br
>>>> brutzman at nps.edu
>>>>
>>>> Watkins 270, MOVES Institute, Monterey CA 93943-5000 USA
>>>> +1.831.656.2149
>>>>
>>>> X3D graphics, virtual worlds, Navy robotics https://
>>>> faculty.nps.edu/brutzman
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>> x3d-public at web3d.org
>>>> http://web3d.org/mailman/listinfo/x3d-public_web3d.org
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>
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